Emilio Mignucci Of Di Bruno’s Brothers

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On this week’s episode of THE CHEF Radio Podcast, host Eli Kulp is joined by Emilio Mignucci to discuss the challenges of operating a family business, the culture and flavors of South Philadelphia, and his ongoing relationship with his Italian heritage.

Emilio is a third generation owner at Di Bruno Bros. and serves as the Vice President of Culinary Pioneering. He’s always on the quest for the latest and greatest eats, and loves telling the stories behind them. He is certified as a cheesemonger by the Certified Cheese Professionals. You can learn more about Emilio and his business at dibruno.com

Transcript:

Eli Kulp: [00:00:00] Welcome back to the CHEF radio podcast. Today we have a great guest, kind of a local food hero in Philadelphia, if you will, Emilio Mignucci. How are you?

Emilio Mignucci: [00:00:07] Fantastic, Eli. How are you doing today?

Eli Kulp: [00:00:11] I'm really great, man. Really excited for this chat. I've been pondering where this will go and thinking about different topics. But I just had this feeling that we're just going to have this natural conversation about food today, and it's going to go where it's going to go the best, right?

Yeah, absolutely. You got a couple of guys that love, love, good food. You, your position. know, As the head of culinary pioneer yet to Bruno's you get to eat some good stuff, man. Yeah. I You're in a good spot. You've built this little empire that needed to get it, eat it all I'm telling you.

Emilio Mignucci: [00:00:43] I'm blessed. And I tell people that my job consists of me eating really good. And then drinking even better.

Eli Kulp: [00:00:52] Yeah. You hit the wine shop, man. You got everything

Emilio Mignucci: [00:00:54] I'm spoiled. Yeah.

Eli Kulp: [00:00:57] Just a little bio on you. Like I said, you're the head of the culinary pioneering at Di Bruno brothers. So essentially your all things, food I'm assuming. So you just take care of the procuring and importing and...

Emilio Mignucci: [00:01:09] the direction of the foods and the trends and the styling, and what where the company is going food wise and then work with the culinary teams for incorporating those specialty products that we get into recipes.

Eli Kulp: [00:01:25] Yeah. If you get some amazing products. You were recognized by the Italian trade commission for your distinguished service, like importing representing Italy. You've, you have a good relationship with Italy. How often do you go over there?

Emilio Mignucci: [00:01:38] When you can, at least once a year. We have makers all over Italy and there's a couple of food shows that I like to get to and make sure that we're seeing the trends and working with my import team on that side to load containers and bring stuff over. And then the other one, every other year, it's usually twice because I hit this low food cheese event in Bra, which is mind blowing..

Eli Kulp: [00:02:06] Wow. Yeah. Bucket list stuff.

Emilio Mignucci: [00:02:07] It is. Yeah. It truly is if you have the time and even if you're a casual foodie, like getting to Bra. Forced slow food, late September, which is a beautiful time of year and the odd numbered years. So like this year, it happens in September and you stay in beautiful, like a castle that's been renovated into a hotel room and they're relatively inexpensive and you just walk for the whole weekend at the town and see vendors putting out their wares, cheesemakers and salami producers. And stuff from all over the world, not just Italy, but Belgium and France and Spain. And you're like, wow, I want this. I want that. You can't get enough. That's great.

Eli Kulp: [00:02:51] Wow. That's great. But so you're Philadelphia born and raised. South Philly, Italian. I remember when I Interviewed Joey Baldino. He talked about growing up in Italian market and it's such a South Philly is its own environment, so to speak. What was it like growing up, like on the block? I know you said your family is really tight knit. What do you remember growing up? Like some of the funnest memories.

Emilio Mignucci: [00:03:30] I got a million stories growing up in South Philly. We know you think South Philly, you think of Italian neighborhoods, red gravy, Parsi, you think of mafia, gangsters, stuff like that, but I grew up in the heart of South Philly, right at ninth and Washington, little street called alter and in, in my heyday, my teen years, young teen years, me and my buddies, we would just hang out and we ate a lot because our mothers cooked and they cooked at different time. So, we'd have two dinners at my house, one at my buddy's house. And then later on that evening, we’d go to Geno’s and Pat’s and get a cheesesteak from each, so and we spent all our lives every day, practically in that park Capitol park across from Geno's and Pat's, and those were the great days. I think back and how blessed we were growing up in South Philly.

And although it was when I grew up and got older and started to travel more, I realized how I don't want to say not secluded, how small South Philly was, but it's a big part of who I am and how I think, and how I react to things today. And it was a blessing.

Eli Kulp: [00:04:48] Very cool. And, you're the face of Di Bruno brothers and you've built this sort of culinary empire, so to speak. Philadelphia is lucky to have you guys, because if you want something unique, special, everybody's go to Di Bruno brothers here.

You're synonymous with great food. And in Philly you're family history is built into what you've been doing because you didn't start it. No. So what was like, talk about your family when they immigrated and that story. ‘Cause it's a really special story. Yeah.

Emilio Mignucci: [00:05:26] My grandparents. When I talk about Danny and Joe, I consider them both my grandparents, then he's my grandfather, Joseph's brother. They had another brother, Thomas, Danny, and Joe, and Thomas came over from Italy around the turn of the century. And they they were young and They Danny being the oldest said nothing more than a third grade education basically.

And so they came over and had an uncle here and stayed with the uncle and started to work in the Italian market at the time. And there was a Greek family who had a couple of shops, retail shops named SaaS Angeles. And they went to work for justice, Angeles family, because when they moved there over here, they lived tenement housing up the small streets, Kimball league.

And they lived on Kimble street in one of those houses with their uncle and how to get to work. And so at the time you either worked in a store or you, if there was a space you made here own space on a stand. And you would go if you had a stand, you would go to dock street and collect your produce and then bring it.

To ninth street and before it was on ninth street, it was on seventh street. And seventh street in Philadelphia was a district of a lot of fabric. It was fabric row, it still is today. And so that's where the businesses were. And so that's why the Italian immigrants who didn't have much.

We're able to just go and set up outside and just sell the fruit and produce, but then eventually a lot of that business moved and shifted to ninth street, which was all ice houses and coal houses. No way. Really? Yeah. There's probably so ninth street used to have these train tracks that used to run.

So the tracks would run from Washington Avenue Delaware, and Washington, all the way to all the way to grays ferry, but it would stop at night and then tr they transitioned a couple of those cars and products to go up and down ninth street. And they would move coal during the winter and ice during the summer to these coal houses.

And so the stands started to eventually set up there in the market. And so San Angeles was one retailer and Greek family who my grandparents went to work for and they learned. Retailing from them as kids and save their money and then eventually open up their own little store where that nine 30 South ninth street is today.

They had a little bit of help from an, I don't know if many people remember or have heard of the module family, but Mario Maggio and his father. So his father was the guy who was the head of the mafia at the time. And they took care of their own people in the neighborhood. And so Mario, my grandfather, Daniel were good friends and they helped him with the payment for the down payment for the first retail shop that we have and my grandfather paid them back.

And then eventually when we I'd taken over the business in 1990 the module family owned that lot. That we have now to Piatsa nice and mantra stuff. And they wanted us to have it, so they sold it to us and that's how we got that space. And my, my grandparents just worked hard all their lives and I'll never forget this.

Like I remember being Jesus six, seven years old and we would go down the shore Wildwood and Danny and Joe, it's funny. The brother Thomas had died a few years earlier and Danny and Joe each bought a house in Wildwood, in the crash right across the street from each other. And as kids, we would go down the shore and.

Where's grandpa, where's he at? And now he's working and he would come down after he, him and my uncle Joe, after they closed the shop on Saturday night, they'd come down and we'd see them. Just for a couple of hours maybe, and then go to sleep. And then I say, we'd have all Sunday with them.

And then Monday they'd leave and go right back to work. Sure. So Sunday was a family day and if we got a day and a half with them, that was a lot. Like I just remember them always working, always pleasant, always happy, always joke, and always feeding and everybody just, you know what it's like, you congregate.

And I don't care if it's a tie in Jewish you can't read it in a kitchen around food because that's the that's the family lifeblood, and that's where communication happens and all. And so like those times are emblazoned in my memory to be such wonderful times and when they decided that they were going to sell the store my cousin, Billy, and he was my partner and where was this?

This was 89. He came to me, he was like, dude, we can't grandpa wants to sell to business. What do we do? We can't let them sell it. And I was like what are you, what do you want to do? And he's Oh, maybe we should buy the business. And it was crazy. And I was like, Oh, like we're 21 years old.

Like kids we know about this stuff. And he like, I don't know like they deserve more they work so hard and he put this in my mind that. Our grandparents build a life and build a life for their families and everything that we do is because of them.

And so we felt yeah, we couldn't let it go away. And because they were such great people that they deserve to have their legacy remain. And that's what the impetus was for us to, yeah. In

Eli Kulp: [00:11:26] my mind, I was thinking they came to you as a guys. We want the store to go keep going why did you take over?

But this is actually something that your cousin though.

Emilio Mignucci: [00:11:35] Yeah. My cousin Billy brought to me and so we he's Oh, we got to call a family meeting. And we got together with his dad. Cause we didn't have no money. We're like, Oh, what did I do? Ask them to give it to us. And we had other.

Cousins who are much younger than us cousins that were like under five years old. And so we were the oldest, me, my cousin, Billy, and my brother Billy. And we called a family meeting and got the family together and Talked to everybody and said we'd like to do this.

And honestly, God, my grandparents, Danny and Joe, and my grandmother's Mary and Sophie that they cried. Like they literally cried because they didn't think that we so from their perspective, these are kids who, when they had the chance to work on Saturdays or Sundays came in late, hung over didn't care as much.

It didn't seem like they cared, like from their perspective. And when we sat them down and said this to them, that they literally cried. And we said we don't want you just to give us the business. We we know there's other grandchildren and we're going to work hard and we want to pay you for it.

And we think that this is, and my cousin just graduated from direction. And so he made a business plan and we said, we think this is what it's worth. And we'll pay you back if you'll finance us. Cause we had no money. If you will finance it for five years, we'll pay you every month, like clockwork for five years and pay it off.

And they're like, and they didn't even want the money, but we insisted and just to see them be so happy that we wanted to take it over was really great. And then working with them for a couple of months to let them know how serious we were to learn everything from them was so

Eli Kulp: [00:13:18] they literally just walk you guys through the business for a few like transition period day in and day out.

And this was the only location was right there

Emilio Mignucci: [00:13:26] on nights. Yeah. Yeah. It was so fun. And so at the same time, like their sister Rita work there and sister-in-law Cecilia and cousin Edith and Angie. And so it was just, so it was so unique that we went, took over this business and they stay. My aunts and uncles, like they all stayed except for Danny and Joe had to retire.

They were in our eighties for God sakes. Wow. And but my aunts really eat of Angie. Like they were so fun and they were like you're the boss now? What do you wanna do? Yeah,

Eli Kulp: [00:14:06] that's cool though. It was like, sounds like everybody was in it to win,

Emilio Mignucci: [00:14:09] but they taught us a lot, man.

They taught us a lot and they were very good. I give them a lot of credit because there's these young kids coming in with all these ideas and they're old, older people that are set in their ways, but they were just such good communicators and they were so loving and they were you'll learn this is why we do it.

And so they really helped us. And their relationship with our customers also went a long way because our customers I'll tell you a quick story We we took over the business and they had not raised prices for a long time. They haven't so Locatelli is a big selling item.

And I remember we're looking at the bills and we're paying the for the wheels. Logan tell you that we're buying. We were buying 30, 40 wheels a week and grading doing everything and selling it to people. And I remember looking at the invoice and the cheese costs us three 49 a pound.

And we were charging three 69, a pound making 20 cents a pound on. And we were like that can't be right. Like you only make 20 cents a pound. Like, how do you make money in this business? And we raised the price of three 79. Customers revolted. When I tell you, what are you trying to get rich overnight?

Your grandfather would have a heart attack, and so we were so nervous that we let all the local old timers who were so locked into that three 69 w that's what we charged them for as long as they want it. And we did. And so we raised the price, but they didn't have to pay it. That's cool.

That's cool. And we were like, ah what do we do? And it was just

Eli Kulp: [00:15:48] revolted. It was how dare you get rich overnight. No, look, the price is

Emilio Mignucci: [00:15:54] this. Yeah, we would show people like the invoice log, we're paying three 49, can't we get an extra nine, so yeah. Yeah. It's good stuff though. Listen, I I remember being grown up and at a time market and not really.

Understanding, no one that I love to eat food. And you asked about South Philly and growing up there. When I went to high school, I went to central high and that was my first experience of outside of my normal environment. And I tell the story a lot. It's funny. Cause I go to school and I'd have for lunch.

My mom would make me whatever the leftovers were the night before. So when she may check in college, I'd have a chicken cutlet, hoagie like a sandwich and take it to school and kids were looking at me like I was crazy. And I'd come with a like a Brown paper bag. Like the big shopping bags, rolled up for a couple of people.

Yeah. But like I was a grown boy and I love to eat and my mom would pack me big bags of chips and shit like that food. And so pretzels, South Philly. Yeah. And so people looked at me like, who the hell eats like that? And I see them I have a white bread sandwiches, peanut butter and jelly or lunch, meat and stuff.

And I'm like I've never had that. Should I go home? And I say, Hey mom, first year. And she's mad at me because I choose central over Newman. And so she says to me, she said, Hey mom, why don't you ever make me peanut butter and jelly? Like on that that white bread. And she's cause you don't like that.

And I said how do you know? I don't like it. You never gave it to me. And she was like, all so the next day she made it for me, send me to school with three sandwiches, peanut butter and jelly and white bread. So I come home and she said how was it. I was like, it was all right. She was like, I told you, you don't like it.

I'm like, I like the combination, peanut butter and jelly. Can you do that on a roll sarcoma? So like I lived around the Chrome sarcoma, so like we would have circle into bread. Or I Nelly's bakery right. With tomato pie and stuff. Cause I take that stuff to school and she, so she would buy loaves of bread and make peanut butter and jelly on the hoagie.

Yeah. I enrolled and I go to school with that and people are looking at me like I was nuts. I don't know. That's what I like fresh baked bread.

Eli Kulp: [00:18:08] These

Emilio Mignucci: [00:18:08] are institutions. And so many people around the world don't grow up like that. Or even just around the United States when you're in the Midwest, like they don't have that access.

And absolutely, I think about how spoiled we were like I had bakeries. All around us and it was Farrah galleys, I and Les and and sarcomas. And pastries bakeries, we terminate and flock goes at the time and his grows it was I went to school there right down the street from Ms.

Gross at St. Paul's. And I remember lunchtime, I'd walk over to his girls and get a cannoli for 25 cents. You would even think twice about, no, are you kidding? These, when the Italians immigrated they essentially just took what they knew and created these little neighborhoods and you think of the great ones you up in the Bronx up there, it's some of the best little Italian community that you got.

I love it. I love when I'm up there, just take a walk around and go in and out of some little small stores and everywhere that I go, I try when I travel, I try to do that everywhere. Just taking the neighborhood whether I'm in France or Italy or Spain just walk and stay local and see what's going on.

And it just makes me feel like I'm in South Philly and just run into the ludas for pasta. That was a great culture, man. I imagine you have kids, right? Yeah. Two boys. So are you, are they interested in the business or do you think that. It's something that they might eventually do one day.

Oddly enough, I started young and my wife and I, and we are married. I was like a baby. We got to have kids young so that when we're old enough to quit. So cause we're all in a struggle regardless. You're right. But when we're older and we can afford it, we can travel and the kids will be old enough and out of our hair and she agreed and she's Oh yeah, that's cool.

So we had kids young, we started early. And so my boys are 29 and 24. Wow. They're five years apart. My oldest son is working for us now. He's back in the company. He, they both grew up in the business doing stuff on Saturdays and stuff and working here and there. And my oldest son there was a point where, you know when you grow up in something and it's so familiar to you, you almost take it for granted.

Exactly. Yeah. And he started to really take it for granted and not understand, or be able to respect hierarchy so people that are managing him me was like I've been here since I was eight. So what can you tell me? Kind of thing cocky knows everything. And so my cousin and I sat down and had a conversation and we set a rule that our children, if they want to make this their career, they need to work outside the company for five years and bring something back that they learn outside.

And it doesn't matter what. Industry they work. And as long as they're working and learning, you know what it's like to work somewhere else. So they have a greater appreciation for the business and understand how to and learn how to communicate with people. So Emilio did that. So when I had to let him go, Oh my God, it was the toughest thing, because it was like, you want me to do it?

I was tough because I was like that w he was 1920. And I said, listen to me. I, we sat across the table from you and I are sitting. And I said That. And it's funny what, like in Safa, we call our kids, dad or mom, like my wife calls him, mommy, I call him daddy. And people are like, why do you do that?

And I'm like, I don't know. It's just what we do in South. My parents always called me dad or mom. And it was just a nickname that in South Philly they give that we give to our kids. It's kinda strange, but I didn't realize how strange it was. So somebody brought it up to me to hear me talking to Emilio and I'm calling him, dad calling him, dad, it's a nickname.

So he's sitting across from me and I'm like, Hey dad, listen you got to go, we have to he's what do you mean I got to go? And I said, we have to let you go. You have to go and find another job somewhere, anywhere doing anything. And he said, what am I going to do? I just thought I just rent an apartment.

I moved down. I'm like, what am I going to do? I can't believe you're doing this to me. And I'm like that please. And literally I was tearing up and I was like, you got to go, you need to learn certain things. And. If you want to go back to school, I'm happy to pay for it. It's your last chance.

And cause he, he went to college for a year and a half and hated it. He's a lot like me, like I'm a doer and that's why like coming out of high school, I needed to go and work with my hands. And that's why I went to culinary school because I never saw myself sitting in a lecture hall for three hours and stuff like that.

I got to do it. And if I'm going to read about it, it's gotta be something I'm interested in. To grab you so culinary stuff like history, food, history, like that grabs me. But this bigger history like now I get it right. Because culture is part of that. And I'm interested in that.

Yeah. But I couldn't see myself doing it when he told me that he didn't want to go to college anymore. I was like, all right you gotta get a job or something. He came to work for us. And this was when all this happened. So he decided to go back to culinary school and he did. And here in the city to the restaurant school and so he finished there and he well going to restaurant school, he went and got his own job, but he knew all my buddies.

He knew Mark Vetri Ellen union. So he went and I asked, but can you give me a job? And so Mark, I'll never forget Mark calls me and he's dude, I said, what's up? He's your son just left. I'm like, Oh, really? What's up? And he said he asked me for a job.

He's should I give him so he didn't go through you? No. Yeah. He does it on his own. And and so it's so funny. I'm like, so what should I do? I'm like, dude, if you need the help and you want to hire them, feel free. Like he doesn't need a special ride. He needs to learn. He's tell me what happened. And I told him, I said, listen. So he hierarchy, he needed to understand what it's like to work for somebody else. He needs to understand he needs to humble himself. And I said, so I wouldn't give him a big possessed stardom, like washing dishes and stuff.

And I said, if you need utility and he said, yeah, I'll do it. Like I could use them. I, and I know he's good pedigree. He's your son. So he's, I know he's going to be a great worker. And I said, yeah, but you just gotta like you gotta manage his expectation. And Mark was fine. He's I got, I'll make them work for Jeff and Jeff we'll handle them.

So he did, he went to work for them for awhile and loved it, and worked his way up and volunteered for everything and did a lot of prep. And worked his way from prep to getting on the floor and busing, and then doing a little serving and Alice spina and partially in Osteria. And he loved it and got along great with everybody there, Jeff Meesha Mark and stuff.

And then he went to work for Ellen and to learn something else. She wanted to deal with Ella. She wanted to bring them over a fork and he wanted it was, I guess it was, maybe it was right before you or no. When you guys got together, he went to a bar and worked over there and as a, as a bus and while he was in school while I was in culinary school.

Yeah. And he did that for a period. And then he befriended this guy the chef, I forget his name, young kid, great kid. Who's now working at Lincoln financial field was working for my buddy, Jimmy Hennessy at Lincoln financial field, but he was at state side and Emilio went there and worked those guys in much smaller group and started bar back.

And then tendon bar, George 17. Yeah. That was after George, right? Okay. George had left. And this young guy had taken over and Emilio became really good friends with him and I guess, out of culinary school and so he started taking on a lot more responsibility there and he was learning his way.

And then five years to the day, he he he's like dad You said five years, really? You want it back yet? Yeah. He was dying to get back and it's so funny. So he he come to me and he tells me that and I'm like, all right let me think about it. So then he goes around me, he goes with my cousin bill who loves him it love, loves Emilio.

So my cousin was like, Oh yeah, we got to bring them back. And I was like, okay, all right. And we're going to start them from receiving in the back. So he learns every part of our business. And now he's been back for a good four years or so. And he's doing great. He actually, I didn't even know this last week.

They just promoted him to assistant store manager at the Rittenhouse store. Okay. My ops team. And so he told my wife and then I get home. Cause he came over to my house for dinner and he was telling me. And he's my wife said, it's a good thing. Your dad wasn't there. They didn't ask your dad.

Cause he wasn't giving you that. I'm proud of my son. He's doing good work. Yeah. He's learned as a teenager 1920, 20, we know it. All right. And then we realize we get in the industry, you don't know anything. And it's always about getting better and learning to be better and honing your skills and getting smarter and working smarter, not harder.

And he's getting to that point and it's great. And right now my younger son is out of the business for five years and he's figuring his way. And they're both my Emilio is engaged to get married next year. And Dante, my youngest son is looking to get engaged in a few months and cool.

Yeah. That's great though. I nobody's home anymore. So my wife and I we've moved back to the city. We sold our house in Delaware County and back to the city and loving life here. And right now square riddles. Yeah. They were there. Yeah. Right there at the Harper it was great. It's a great building.

It's convenient. We walk places. I can't wait for spring for anything to open up.

Eli Kulp: [00:28:34] I know, yeah. Yeah. It's going to be a very welcome sight yeah. To see those those plants starting to pop. Oh yeah. Yeah. For sure. So I know you're, you oversee all the culinary side and you guys have a, you're not just talking to more about just bringing in cheeses and meats and cutting them.

You've grown this business into a restaurant company, a catering company. When you guys originally took over the store in 89. Yeah. Did you already have these other measures, like these other goals, like teed up ready to go, or

Emilio Mignucci: [00:29:16] Oh, we're young immature and naive. We had no clue what we were doing or what we were going to do.

And like we were just trying to get through every day of the Italian market retail store. And like I would go in at five in the morning and make fresh mozzarella for the day. I could never get caught up and make enough for two days cause we'd sell out and I stayed late and we'd make our spreads.

Cause we used to make the cheese spreads there and just like it's just try and get ahead. Like, all we knew was what we were doing. We're still trying to figure it out. But over time we started. Hiring kids and people to work with us as my aunts retired and moved on, we needed to fill some voids.

And we realized we had something special going on with product that when we took over the business, my grandfather said, Danny ultimately said, he said, listen, it's really people choose. To come and shop here. They don't have to shop up here. You need to make them feel welcome.

Like it's your house. And he's had a few different things. It doesn't cost you anything to smile. They don't want to see or know that you're having an issue or a problem. My grandfather, Danny, when you went into the store and every time I went in there, he was like, he was on a stage performing giving out samples and talking them half in Italian and half in English and making them feel good.

And so he's that's what you have to do. And whenever you get a chance, he's you never have to worry about, he's like the more time you spend worrying about what the other guy's doing, your competitors, the less time you're spending on your business, that's some great advice.

And we thought to ourselves you know what, you're right. Let's just focus on what we do and not worry about everybody else in the supermarkets and who we're competing against. And so that. Helped us to really think about as we would talk with them over and over again, if you have an opportunity to upgrade, you just do it.

Like you upgrade your product. And so like our product was just constantly being upgraded to a better product and better product. And what makes it better? You start thinking to yourself and for us over time we started to realize it's the product is the product, but it's more about the people behind the product.

And so we, I worked with I'm on the board of the specialty food association. And prior to being on that board, I was on the board of the American cheese society and in learning about cheesemakers and made me think about That this product has a story. These cheeses have a story and these cheeses, their story deserves to be told, but the people are attached to it.

And so there's culture there. And our job was to be like this Walt Disney of the food world and make people expose them to something new and exciting that they didn't know they even wanted. And so for us getting to know the cheesemakers like Mary keen, who created humble fog when she invented that cheese it blew everybody's mind.

And I used to call Mary keen. That's so crazy. And she's such a pioneer. And I just call her out of the blue. So how do I keep your cheese? What do I do with it? And having those conversations with cheesemakers was something that people weren't doing. And I joined the American cheese society at the time.

In the mid nineties, it was because I wanted to know more about cheese and have, and be the best at cheese. And so my cousin was like yeah, let's do it. Let's do it. Really pushing like to be great, let's be, so

Eli Kulp: [00:33:03] you had this vision of expanding the cheese that you

Emilio Mignucci: [00:33:08] serve there.

When we took over like Danny, their ex access to cheese was roughly about 50, 60 cheeses Italian, French, Brie was abused, seller, parmigiano Reggiano. Of course it still is, and I started. I started talking to these cheesemakers and I wanted to tell these stories and like to talk to somebody who's pioneer and learn from them.

And then I they're like, Oh, you should come to the conference. And so I go to the conference and it's all cheesemakers. And so me and a couple of other retailers are at this conference. And then we started realizing we need to get more retailers at these conferences because he's Cheeseman at the con the American cheese decided he never made any money.

So I worked with, and you'll know some of these guys like max McAlmont, right? Yeah. And max, I get to meet max and we're just. Talking about cheese, like crazy he's talking one way, I'm talking another way. We meet Daphne Zappos and she's talking about cheese another way, and then Sue Starman.

And so the four of us get together and we say we should create something like like the wine, some acorn do a cheese course and let's create the S it eventually became known as the chief certification test, and CCP certified cheese professionals. And so we create, we started working with this and I would literally go up to New York.

Every two weeks on a Monday and spend a day with those three guys really max me, definitely Matt Sue Starman. And we would just talk, jeez, we couldn't get, we couldn't get, we couldn't get Steve Jenkins was involved. They didn't want no part of busy running a fairway and doing his work there.

But we used him as a base model for helping them create this this certification. And max at the time was in the middle of writing a book, his first book. And so we were just like, we wanted the industry to speak one way about GS. And so when we, because eight years, eight years to get this big package and then hand it over to the American cheese society so that they can then.

Help raise money to create the test because the test costs hundreds of thousands of dollars to create. And we didn't have those funds, but we wanted to give the American cheese society a, a revenue stream. And if we gave him this, people would speak the same way about it and not just retailers, but then it became cheesemakers and restaurant professionals and so it started to speak to a lot of people and that's how ACS had grown.

And then that's where I catapulted them to from working on that committee, to being on the board, served my board term and then transitioned over to a specialty food onto that board, which is I forgot why, how I got so far out of the way, but we just know

Eli Kulp: [00:36:15] all about specialty foods. I think we're talking about the.

Yeah, India, the ones that you know, your grandfather and uncle hat, and now how you've grown into this. Oh, yeah. How's the cheese essentially,

Emilio Mignucci: [00:36:28] right? Yeah. And so we took that idea at the Bruno brothers and said, Oh geez what's the next thing? Like it's olive oil, right? Cause, cause we were selling Colavita then.

And some of the basics that you would see in supermarkets, but we realized we couldn't keep selling those because we couldn't compete with the supermarkets. They were always. Two and $3 cheaper. Their margins are 35%, not 50% where we need to be because we're trying to pay people to stay and grow with us.

And I remember when we cut Colavita out of our offering Giovanni Colavita and John came to visit us. And yeah. Cause my grandfathers were good friends, my grandparents, because of their import inquisitive found me and we're good friends with the, of isn't it. And yeah. Colavita they paid you a visit.

Hi. Yeah. I was like, how'd you feel, find out like, how do you even know we stopped? They said we know everything. Why would you stop caring? I, and I was honest with them. I said, listen I, we can't compete with the supermarkets. I need the, we need a double, our money make 50% gross and they're selling it for nine 99.

I got to charge 1299. You're charging me $7 for this. But at a time in distribution, it gets to me and they said We'll make it whatever price you want it to be. You want to pay $4 a bottle, you pay $4 a bottle, but you have to keep it in your school. So we're like, okay, should we match the price of the supermarket at nine 99?

And that lasted a little while. And then Giovanni, eventually got it. I says, distribution has grown. And he's Klobuchar realizing that that needs to be this way. And but he was very helpful in helping us get to do lots of imports and work with creating private label or finding small producers in Italy to work with.

And that's where that, because in this business, like in any business is about who and your relationships that you create. And you tell those stories like those cheese makers now, like we sell olive oils from small from families so I want to, I want people to know that when you shop at the Bruno brothers, yeah, it might be a little bit more expensive, but what you're paying for.

Is the family name on that product, then that's where the money's going. And one of the guys that worked for me coined a phrase called the Athleta use a long time ago that we still use today, glocal globally, local. And so when we look at keeping funds local, like here in Pennsylvania and Philadelphia in and around Lancaster County, whatever, wherever we feel the same way globally.

Who are those small families doing great work that need to be represented. And that's where we channel our energies and start to tell them, I love that phrase

Eli Kulp: [00:39:09] because yes, it's coming across the ocean or whatever, but. This is still the taste of this local, this place. And that's what I love about Italy.

You can drive two miles and you're tasting different cheeses, different foods, different flavor profiles, amazing. Uh, One, one, one Valley to the next Valley, one mountain Ridge to the next mountain Ridge sound real. And it's you got porcinis now, then you got this over

Emilio Mignucci: [00:39:36] there.

Yeah. The overly mushrooms, it's just so great. It is. And yeah.

Eli Kulp: [00:39:41] Italy is such special place. Yeah. I could go on forever. It's my, it really is you talk about happy place for me. If I get to go to the shows in Parma or a Milano, I'll go, but then I always stay a few extra days and go visit this my smaller producers, like outside those areas, or we're down South near where my family is in huskily PHN or where is your family originally from.

Emilio Mignucci: [00:40:08] In a Brousseau Bruto and LaMarca it used to be all one. And it's split now you have a brutal and LaMarcus, so right at that border iStat, UMMA in a brutal, and then Ashley PHN in the market. And so I have family on both sides of that border there within a hundred kilometers of each other, but and really, it's just such a, it's such a blessing.

Eli Kulp: [00:40:31] So you, you still have family that you keep in touch with? No. Yeah,

Emilio Mignucci: [00:40:35] totally. Yeah, absolutely. That's cool.

Eli Kulp: [00:40:37] That's great. What's your family over there? Are there, what is their, what's their I dunno, their attitude on life.

Emilio Mignucci: [00:40:46] It was very European we live life to its fullest every day and that's how they take it, and they work as, yeah, I don't wanna say as little as possible, but they work enough to live a good life and it's really about family and food. And we like to say, so we take a little bit of everything from everywhere at the Bruno brothers. And we we celebrate really great food and really great people.

And in turn that helps us celebrate really great business. And that's part of our core values.

Eli Kulp: [00:41:19] That's great, man. Yeah. It's a special. Special family

Emilio Mignucci: [00:41:24] bond. I'd say I I do, I feel very blessed, very lucky. I'm in a business and an industry, a fantastic industry that's ever evolving and ever changing.

And there's so many great people in this industry.

Eli Kulp: [00:41:38] I say that the artisan maker never before, has there been more opportunity for them to succeed? People are looking for those stories, so would you say that your stores have grown at the same trajectory that you know that the consumer has been seeking out these specialty more and more specific type of producers?

Emilio Mignucci: [00:42:03] That's an interesting question. Yes. For us. Yes. But when I look at the, so being on the board of specialty food as I look at what is specially. It's hard to define, right? How we define specialty is almost Uber specialty, but you can go in supermarkets, any supermarket and find specialty food Isles and have specialty.

And for us, we need got people. I got a specialty food world. We need the supermarkets to be to be exposing their guests, to these products, ethnic foods ethnic specialty goods. And then what we do is we provide a platform for the new people to to really find their way. So eventually it gets to us, the pace has gotten quicker Nat like year over year.

Yes. But there's still a large segment of the population that. Is nervous or afraid or is not willing to try new things. Newness is good for us. Newness has to be really great and an upgrade and it really it's as much about the people behind the product as it is how great the product is.

It's very important for us because how many sauces are out there? How many cheeses are out there? How many, I don't jams, jellies. Honey's there's lots of them. And you have to narrow the scope from our perspective, the supermarkets have more space to show more. We have to be a little bit more selective.

But it's exciting. It's exciting.

Eli Kulp: [00:43:50] What do you think has, what do you think about your brand has endured. The sort of what is the supermarket crunch that so many small producers or small stores have had to deal with? Of course, the online ordering online, shopping, Amazon. And then what is it, how have you seen that also impact like Italy, for example, where supermarkets are now more common and the smaller producer are shop owner being squeezed.

How do you combat those challenges?

Emilio Mignucci: [00:44:34] I think if you take the if you take the idea that with every challenge comes opportunities you will find those silver linings and be able to persevere. It's not. It's not it's not as difficult. It's just a matter of sit back, take a deep breath, think about it and then dig a little deeper.

There's always going to be small producers all over the place, not just Italy, Spain, France here in the U S that are creating and doing great stuff. Never going to stop. Like the innovators ingenuity doesn't stop innovation. Doesn't stop. There's always something. And the things that we were fortunate to be part of at the Bruno brothers back in 2012, we formed a group.

We started in 2010. We formed a group of retailers called the good food retailers, collaborative. We started the good food foundation and the retailers collaborative allows young. Small innovators, people who produce limited quantities of product and need a platform. So there were nine retailers around the country to got together to do this.

It was us, it was Zingerman's Bi-Rite market out in San Francisco. Ansanelli is down in Texas,

Eli Kulp: [00:45:58] the national sort of network of specialty food

Emilio Mignucci: [00:46:02] stores. Yeah. Retailers that are helping to mentor young makers right. For what's needed. And yeah.

Eli Kulp: [00:46:13] The the idea of a makers it's almost gone the way of the Dodo bird for the next generation.

So you're saying, how do we keep inspiring these. The next generations to do this. That's amazing what

Emilio Mignucci: [00:46:25] they need to know that there's a platform for them. And that there are people that are willing to listen, but more importantly, feedback, valuable information to make their product the best that it can be.

Okay. And so it started with nine of us. Now we're up to 20 retailers that fund this we funded about 20,000. We paid $20,000 a year to fund this group per retailer, but the makers, we give them information. They, we have an, a little awards thing, a tasting, we but so now if it's somebody here local I don't know, take Jill does a biscotti, right? And so Jill has been a friend of mine for years and we've been selling it for Scotty. And so I get her to the good foods and she presents we have criteria for every category, right? And so you need to be sustainable. And in certain ways you need to be using local product, right?

The same sustainability pertains to how your, where your ingredients are coming from for your product. So you need to be able to be supporting your local area and so there's a lot. So every category and now we have. 14 categories has its own set of criteria and you have to meet this criteria.

So now the product's been vetted, right? For us as retailers it's been vetted. And w we don't have to ask the questions. We would normally ask to make sure that it's natural, they're using good ingredients and at the same time we're helping the maker. Make the best product they can.

And we will also our group, we have a little team in our office in San Francisco that helps those people, wherever they are, find where they can get the ingredients to upgrade their product and make it better. And so let's deep. Yeah. And so now they start, so if you can only supply me, maybe you can apply a few other people.

And so like you can go outside Pennsylvania, maybe the tri-state area, maybe you do East coast, like eventually you build up. So it gives them a runway. And it allows these young makers to set an expectation for their growth and how they handle and scale their growth, which is very important. We offer grants and funding and it's a great way to 11.

Now we tell them, you need to have a vision for what your product is. Of course you eventually want to be in a supermarket. Do you eventually want to be in all the whole foods? I don't know, but some people do and not all of them do and want to, so when we understand the vision, we can help you get to where you want to be.

And we are going to be a platform to be able to catapult you into that. We know that's eventually what happens at our level, right? So what is the name of it? The good food retailers collaborative for retailers, but it's a good food foundation is the umbrella good. And everything is under there, right?

So all the makers are in there. So when you go to the website, you see all the makers in every state. That we helped get Oh, that's cool. A platform to help create a product. And you're talking about we have, I believe by now we have every state represented in a lot of different ways.

And so there's charcuterie producers and cheese maker you name it olive oil, so that's good stuff and that's the stuff at the Bruno brothers that makes us keeps us, I don't want to say relevant, but for lack of a better word relevant keeps inspiring us to want more because that's what we're here.

Like we're a conduit between the end-user and the maker. Yeah. Essentially my job is to bring in great product. That really means something on both sides. That's

Eli Kulp: [00:50:12] us. I've I've never worked in retail. So it's fascinating that there's, that you're, that you guys are able to do these or build these this runway, so to speak and it helps everybody, right?

It's it helps you guys also keep new, fresh ideas

Emilio Mignucci: [00:50:30] it's coming through and focused like I think that everybody, no matter what you're doing, you need to have a focus and you need to be, you need to understand where you fit in and what your value is to that industry or to your community, or find your place and the Quip because like it'll help you to maintain and to continue roll on a continually evolving it's all good stuff, man.

It's

Eli Kulp: [00:51:01] that's cool. You must, I imagine that you feel. You have a legacy product with Roberta brothers. And I imagine that you don't see this thing ever stopping now,

Emilio Mignucci: [00:51:16] right? Beyond you. Yeah. Yeah. We're setting this thing up to just continue on because it's, and again, I'll just go back.

Like our mentality in the beginning was to To honor our grandparents, the Bruno family built a fantastic foundation for us to grow on. And we had no idea. We were young and dumb at the time early twenties, but people, we realized that people would shop at the Brunos and then go away on vacation and send us postcards and letters.

And we were like, are these people nuts? Like when I send the letter to my favorite retail store I don't know that's great, but right. And, but we started to realize that the customers felt a bit of an ownership. And how lucky were we. That they felt that way. And before we opened our second store, we had a focus group.

We didn't know they were called focus groups at the time. We just invited some of our best customers and regular customers to come in after hours. And we would feed them cheese and wine. And let's talk about if we should open a second store or not. And we literally did that really and like we didn't call it a focus.

We didn't notice, but we did. We brought these people into the cheese shop anytime market after hour. And then that's what helped us to create this after hours program, where people come and spend time at the Bruno brothers and enjoy a little party and like things evolve. We didn't say we're going to have six retail stores, our restaurant and important distribution business, a manufacturer.

We never said that those things happened because we had really great people who helped us to create such a great culture. And they had other ideas that warranted us. Paying attention to it. And it's vertically integrating into what we do and just made sense, where we are. We made it make sense.

I don't know. That's

Eli Kulp: [00:53:14] the thing, because from what I understand, like you don't have, you didn't go to school and get a business degree and say, let's create a ten-year plan. Now

Emilio Mignucci: [00:53:23] we do. Yeah. We do think about that now 10 year vision, what's our five-year plan. What's our three year strategic plan.

Like we do that now when we bring people in and it's nice when we bring these young people in now, because like they have ideas that we would never have. Like we're, I don't want to say old and stodgy, but like things that you're seeing, like fun stuff, that's going on. We didn't come up with these things.

We have young people that have these great ideas and are helping us think outside the box and helping us push the limits because. To your point this is, we want this to be here way past us, past my kids beyond and the businesses there for everybody at the Bruno brothers, not just for Emiley.

Oh, and bill it's there for everybody that works at the Bruno's. Rocko, rhino and Matt Bell's Hunter fight, like all these people that make a difference at the Bruno brothers.

Eli Kulp: [00:54:21] Do you have. Do you still have family like working like your cousins, kids? Do they couple, do they want to be a part of it?

So it's,

Emilio Mignucci: [00:54:31] yeah, it's great. And to have my cousin, Tommy is in the business with us has been for a while and yeah I we're fortunate and the business is open we've had some come work for awhile and leave my cousin Danny works at the Ardmore store. Tommy runs the time market operations.

He's moving out to Wayne when we opened that location next month. Yeah I that's what it's there for and the families of the people that work for us so over,

Eli Kulp: [00:55:03] see, when did you open your second store? What year was that?

Emilio Mignucci: [00:55:07] So we opened, so you tell him why I got a second store was Rittenhouse.

And that was opened in 90. So we had the small spot before we opened the big store. And that was in 99, I think, 10 years later roughly about nine, 10 years later. And where was that? That was on 18th street. That was on 18th. Yeah. W where the meat and seafood department is now. That was just a little cheese shop.

Oh, I see. There was a French cheese shop that quarter. Yeah. Then we moved right around the corner when I came up for sale, but there was a little French cheese shop there called or Ray, and the guy who owned the array came to us and it was like, I can't make it work here. You guys wanted to just take over my lease.

And we're like, and he said if it just costs us our product, then like we have plenty of product and we'll see if it works. And that's how we got into center city. And then eventually opened a prepared food store because we would go back and forth to New York and I'd visit we'd visit with Dean of the Lucas bowel, do cheese Grace's market.

And we got very friendly with about do cheese. And they started the open up the back door to us and say, Hey, or this is how we do it as cool. We're like, Oh, cause we had no idea how to scale, how to do anything. And they were genuine people, the nicest were like, yeah, whatever you need, we'll help you.

You need help bringing something in are important. And so working with them for minimums. A product to bring over the volumes. Great. And we were one store now, too, and we're getting into prepared foods, so they would

Eli Kulp: [00:56:53] show us all that stuff to the containers and you would go up to New York and bring it back

Emilio Mignucci: [00:56:57] down.

Yeah. Or just have a private hall or pick it up and send it down, and yeah. And then, and we knew prepared foods was a thing was going to be a big thing. And because they were doing like crazy, nobody was doing a better than Balducci's honest, honestly got in our opinion.

And and crisis market, which is the spinoff the daughters bought. And then we started to meet everybody else in New York who was doing it, ideal cheese shop. And we were just like, W we go like once a month and visit with them and then apply some of it. And they really are the Philly guys here.

Yeah. We had fun and that's how I we got to meet maximum account and I just I was just enamored with all those guys, Terrance, and and did,

Eli Kulp: [00:57:49] but it was artismal. Yes.

Emilio Mignucci: [00:57:54] Yeah. He had pizza lean and I remember going up there for dinner and eating a feature Lee and I was like, wow you got to cheese Samia and it just and that stuff inspired us. And that drove us into prepared foods. And we had to prefer two stores on 18th street and they were both on 18th street.

And then we said, we got to put them together. And that's when we found the other store on Chestnut. For sale and we put it all into one and then kept one store in 18. So we can cut an opening and knock it through and have that. But

Eli Kulp: [00:58:26] it's a beautiful store now. Yeah. Thanks. Sure. Thank you. Beautiful. No it's always a lot of fun to visit the store because taste some cheese, a couple of things.

Emilio Mignucci: [00:58:39] Yeah. It's good stuff. What do you, what would you

Eli Kulp: [00:58:41] say your top three cheeses are like if you had personally

Emilio Mignucci: [00:58:47] perfect. That's easy. Yeah. Yeah. I like I'm I'm such a traditionalist like for me, parmigiano Reggiano, but you gotta have it Sergio Cravero his parm, the selection of his farm is one of my absolute favorites.

It's freezes guys off. He's an, he's the apartment. He he's in bra. Okay. So what he does is he is. Fifth generation select their parmigiano selector. And Giorgio is such a brilliant guy. His father is his father. Giacomo is the one that really taught me about parmigiano Reggiano back in 2001.

When I was in bra for the slow food cheese event, I was with Ari winery from Zingerman's and another buddy of ours. And Aria said, I'm going to meet Giacomo Cravero for a parm tasting. Why don't you come with me? It was my first time in bra and I said, okay, fine. So we walked to his house and his house is attached to his warehouse full of parmigiano Reggiano.

And all you could smell is really delicious plum. And I go in. With Ari and Ari, he's got his notebook and he's taking his notes and my mind is blown already. And Giacomo was like 10 o'clock in the morning, comes out with Prosecco and a whole table full of different ages of parmigiano Reggiano. And his son Giorgio was there.

Now, Giorgio is my age. And back then, I'm going back almost 20 years. And so we were in our thirties, 34, 35. And Jacqueline was teaching us about these different ages apart and from different areas that he gets me and really teach me how to taste. Now. I thought in the food world, culinary you taste, but you taste finished.

It's different than tasting cheeses. It's different than evaluating a cheese. And my, my mind was blown. I started really loving one of these cheeses and Georgie was there with us and jock mom's retired now, Georgia took over the business. And we started to import his cheese back then.

And so we had our house parmigiana, which is our really great export quality. And then we had Cravero farm that we sold and I come up with this tagline. It's not a commodity, this is not your commodity. This is a table. Jeez. Something to snack on. And so that's why for me, this parmigiano Reggiano from Giorgio Corvera their selection is one of my absolute favorite sweet, fruity nutty, and different times of the year, spring, summer, winter, like it, the milk changes.

Drastically. Wow. And just to en which is, I think,

Eli Kulp: [01:01:36] why are those like GNG salt crystals there? Yeah, it depends

Emilio Mignucci: [01:01:40] on the time of the year. And so like I like gin and I like the varieties of Jim because they're also different the recipes. And so this cheese just reminded me of these differences when you taste the spring, the summer, the winter and the ages.

And so that's one that we always have. And is one of my absolute favorite. So primary show parmigiano Reggiano by Jojo Corvera is always in my fridge. All right. One of my other favorite cheeses, just from grand, a grand day provolone, like they make a Monda rainy provolone for us when they started doing so there a mozzarella cheese company and they make some of the best pizza cheese in the industry and we were distributing the cheese, but they were doing our mozzarella for us, our fresh if you're the latte, but we needed a good Mandarino problem on domestic one and they made one.

So the beauty of grounding they're there in the States. Yeah. They're in Wisconsin. The beauty of Granda is that what you see now, they work with sustainability and they make sure that they're They're farmers that are raising their cows are getting the best feed. They supplement all of it by giving their cows the best feed to produce the highest butterfat milk and the highest quality milk.

And which is why granddad is second to no one in the pizza world. And because they have such great milk, they were able to make this great domestic provolone that I just love so much. And it's always in my fridge, it's a sharp neck. It just reminds me of my grandparents. And so that's why like that, like those two cheeses are always in my fridge.

I'm a big blue cheese guy. So cost ambassadors, Stilton, like the best Stilton that we sell. It's deeper chocolate and a finished. The rind is spectacular and it's my favorite blue in the world. Now. I love all kinds of blues and yeah, from the UK. And it's just, it's. My wife and I will go through, I don't know.

I take home every week, probably about two and a half pounds every other week. I take them. And so we go through about two and a half, five pounds a month, my wife and I go it's a popular cheese in our house. Just what does eat that with a salad? It's just pretty versatile, so good.

But those three are like my absolute favorites, but there's so many manners. So many

Eli Kulp: [01:04:02] people get overwhelmed at the cheese counter. They do. Thank you. What is, what do you tell your cheesemongers? Because they're always so ready to talk and they're what do you want to, what do you want to try?

Because train cheese is part of the process of buying cheese and they're generous and they're there to help. What do you expect from those guys when they're interfacing

Emilio Mignucci: [01:04:25] with the customer? Yeah. That's exactly what we expect, so yeah. At the Bruno brothers and they all know this, like our mission is to make your day better when you're leaving than when you came in.

So they're empowered and everybody right. One was empowered to make you happy, make your day. Great. And so when you go to cheese counter, they know that they are looking that as a subject matter experts. So we expect them to be so we do a lot of educational training. We expose them to all the cheesemakers and now during COVID it's been zoom calls once a month with a particular cheesemaker and they talk about their product and they ask questions in our tasting it, we expect that they're always tasting product.

If you're cutting a new wheel or something over, make sure you taste it and you understand it. We don't want them just talking about when we're talking about flavors, we try to dig deeper, right? So they have flavor wheels. And so if they tell me it's nutty, tell me what kind of nutty think deeper are we talking about.

A roll nut or a toast and not, are we talking about a peanut? Are we talking about a Walnut? Are we talking about a hazelnut? What are we talking about? Is it yeasty bread? Dig a little deep. So we try to get their minds so that when they're talking to customers, they're not just using basic.

You need the sound like a subject matter expert. You can't sit there and just say, Oh, here's a sweet nutty cheese. You know that anybody can say that. So we expected there tasting, taken notes, taking mental notes and understanding the product or selling. Now we know we have a lot of cheese in the case, not every Jesus' every monger's favorite, but every monger has a handful of favorites that they go to.

And so what happens is we let that guide the purchasing of that cheese counter, right? So if there's any time market, there's seven cheesemongers out of those seven, between those seven, there's probably. 60 or 70 cheeses that those seven guys love to sell. And then we supplement it with. Seasonal unique specialty, a special cheese maker, whatever.

And so and that's how you build, we build the counter out so that it makes sense for who's behind the counter because that I love Cravero parm the guy next to me, like grant loves solar, the Bruna Brown cow, parmigiano Reggiano. And so for me, I'm going to recommend the Cravero because I love it.

And I can talk passionately about it and tell your story. Grant's going to sell you on his parmigiano, the Brown cow, because he loves a Brown cow because it's an agent cow. And it's one of the aside from the vodka Rosa, the Brown cow is has this very unique, very interesting flavor in the finished toasted like brioche notes which is somewhat unique.

And but that's what he likes and everybody's taste is different,

Eli Kulp: [01:07:19] right? Yeah. We see you as the at Del Posto for one

Emilio Mignucci: [01:07:23] of the reasons we did the vodka, Rosa it's just a, it's a spectacular one. We have them all, we saw that one. And so that's the that's the beauty of

Eli Kulp: [01:07:33] the apartments, it makes you right. There's, it's so good. Listen, it's the King of cheese for a reason because it's probably one of the greatest, most versatile cheeses you could buy a no home should be without. Yep. It's a great snack cheese reading tea. I always have it in the drawer.

Emilio Mignucci: [01:07:49] Yeah you gotta, this is good, man.

Eli Kulp: [01:07:54] So you talked about your legacy a little bit. How do you what does that conversation with you and your partners? As you guys look and say, okay, how much longer do I, am I going to be in it? She loves me do so it's you're always going to be in it to some degree, sure. Into your your elder years and but do you guys talk about. Specific sort of plans or is it just organic? Like you've always

Emilio Mignucci: [01:08:25] been, yeah, so we haven't specifically discussed the transition or what happens because I think we're still not right. Like we asked my son, we're never retiring has Emilio.

He's going to tell you that, Oh my uncle and my father, they're never retired. There'll be here forever. There'll be a thorn in my side forever. Like it it's hard to say we're just opening a new store and we got lots of plans and lots of ideas. And we still got work to do to set it up to to take care of everybody within And we still have a lot of responsibility to a lot of people and to the business, so that listened to it at times.

And maybe we'll never be comfortable with it. But right now times are a little shaky. It's this evolution of what's to be is going to be interesting. I can't really answer that question. We don't specifically say, Hey in 10 years or in 20 years, or we should but what we do is make sure that we're setting people up for success.

And it's more important. The question we ask ourselves is what's in the best interest of the business and if it supports the business and is taken care of these people, then that's what we're going to do. Yeah.

Eli Kulp: [01:09:47] Yeah. I feel like it's sincerely like you guys are you guys are a standup.

Amazing place to go and just be educated on your product. It's hard to explain, right? So when you go to a specialty store, you're shopping, but you're all, it's more of you're going to experience things You said that not everybody sees it that way, but yeah. Like we, we are of the mentality that of you're coming to our shop that you want to experience something really great.

Emilio Mignucci: [01:10:20] Yeah. Every once in a while you run into a customer who doesn't care for the experience and just must get what they want to get. And so it takes some reading the customer and understanding the customer. And sometimes like our people are so used to giving an experience that when somebody shuts them down like that, they're like, Oh my God what's wrong with that?

Listen, that's just that they want to get in and out. Don't worry about it but you're right. Yeah.

Eli Kulp: [01:10:45] You want to experience something special? And he goes, pull it off and

Emilio Mignucci: [01:10:50] you guys pull it off. Yeah. Listen it, honestly, God, I like my grandpa said, it's easy when you have great product, you never have to make an excuse.

And we which is why if there's, if somebody comes along with something and it's an upgrade or something we have, then we would do it. If it makes total sense. It's because the product's easy. Oh, we gotta do is smile and be happy, know what the product is that we have.

And like that's really all we got. I, you know where the conduit, like I said, between the end-user, I just think

Eli Kulp: [01:11:27] I'm thinking about this So my ex-wife, her family came from originally Sicily, but now they're in Louis on, in, near up in Brusha area. I love it up there. And they're in the the they call them the pre Alpines are where the mountains start.

They're like tucked right up in there. And there's a cheese. Her uncle's a trip at just cheese. It was Calandra and called, but

Emilio Mignucci: [01:11:58] ghosts. Yeah. Oh my God. It's so rare. So rare. So rare. So expensive, super expensive. But let me tell you for, because it's a Valley, like it's a low Alpine cheese. It's considered an Alpine.

Have you eaten it?

Eli Kulp: [01:12:15] Yeah, because their uncle is men have to eat this cheese because you eat this cheese. You're going to go all night with your girl.

Emilio Mignucci: [01:12:23] You know what I mean?

Eli Kulp: [01:12:25] Exactly. I know. But he was so convinced that if you eat this cheese, you're going to, it's basically Viagra and this cheese is something

Emilio Mignucci: [01:12:33] else.

Yeah. Subtle flavors and that cheese that's a very specific, like when you talk about bagless battle Mont there's some, there's so many like this they're so unique in that they are true expressions of where they come from. And from S from year to year, the flavor changes. In such a way that you might get a lot of grassy notes or you might not the following year, depending on the weather and what the cows are eating and how they're eating or digesting.

And it's such an interesting sequence. If you're. If you're not used to tasting or evaluating Jesus sometimes just comes off as just like a regular cheese, like a plain ish kind of cheese, but it's not, that is truly a spectacular mountain cheese.

Eli Kulp: [01:13:24] I only seen it one time here. It was at easily.

And yeah, this thing is, it's hard to

Emilio Mignucci: [01:13:31] explain it. Yeah. I was sent a couple of years ago from Mark. Mark wanted it for the winter, for the November, December. And I brought a bunch in and we saw that at the store, but it was like $50 a pound. And that wasn't getting margin. It cost me like $30, $32 a pound to bring in.

Yeah. But

Eli Kulp: [01:13:50] it's such, it's. It's this farmstead she's I remember so we went to the producer and ate it and it's intense, man. It

Emilio Mignucci: [01:13:59] is, it can be

Eli Kulp: [01:14:00] it's but it's not like you're. You think of intense cheese, you think of your wash fry, your your to Lego's and some of those Northern Italy funky cheeses, but this thing is funky in its own.

Yeah.

Emilio Mignucci: [01:14:12] Raw milk. It's a great cheese. It really is. And very unique. It's one of the most unique Jesus that from that area and brush it is the food up there is so killer. Jesus, they're doing all kinds of great stuff. It's one of my favorite spots. Like when I go from Parma to Milano to stop and breast you there just to eat, man love it.

Like I love baloney too. Like you can't buy a bad meal and baloney. So you're walking down the street and you're like, which grandmother do I want to choose her food? Or tortellini. It is crazy. Okay. So good.

Eli Kulp: [01:14:54] Can't wait to get back to Italy. I

Emilio Mignucci: [01:14:55] know. Me too. Cool. Is there anything else you want cover?

Eli Kulp: [01:15:00] I feel like I can talk all day.

Emilio Mignucci: [01:15:03] I know talk all day, especially when we go free flowing like this. I I love it. We got a great industry. It's a little

Eli Kulp: [01:15:10] bit about, cause people are always curious. Yeah. Grew up in South Philly's in the mafia down there and the Philadelphia mafia the whole Northeast essentially.

So you had New York and new Yorkers you hear all the stories in the early days, but what was that energy like down there? Did you just, was it just these were your buddies and they just happened to have some rules that people apply that they

Emilio Mignucci: [01:15:40] applied grow up around it, like it's happening around you.

And so it's normal. It's just like normal life. Like you just see. Yeah. Like I grew up this little street alter street between eighth and ninth, between Washington and Ellsworth and right down at the corner. It's around the corner. If you if you watch the Irishman the friendly lounge was right around the corner, right?

So the friendly lounge was there. And then across catty-corner across from where the gas station was was a clubhouse, right? Lancaster, this guy owned, this, had this club house and it was all like mobsters would hang out there and just play cards all day gin, Rami, whatever. And as kids growing up like we're kids, and we just, we didn't know any different, but these were just dudes in the neighborhood, older dudes.

And so we'd be hanging out, down there, outside the club or running in now. And they'd say, Hey here's a couple dollars, go get us some coffees or here's a couple dollars, go get some ice cream, we'll get some candy for the kids. Go do whatever. And so you just grow up. Around it. And then as you get older and you start to understand, I realized right from wrong and what's you make a decision, right?

Like what path you want to go? And you totally have friends that go that way. Cause it's inevitable. And it's just, you just cooperate and it's just second nature. It's just like something you're around. And I grew up at a lot of dudes who aren't bad guys w went in that direction, but that was their skillset.

You know what I mean? Everybody's got a skill set, everybody's got a a a little voice in the back of their head, tell him what to do. And it's just the way it is and there's room for all of it. And that's the kind of stuff that helps to shape you.

I grew up, I worked in this. I was in high school at central high, and I worked in seventh and Qaeda right now. What's the name is right there at nomad pizzeria. They used to be this restaurant called Frank's seafood. And I used to work there 14, 15 years. Yeah. No, I bus, I do prep in the bag and I bused tables.

And then they had upstairs the second floor. And on the weekends, Friday, Saturday, and Sunday night, it was like this little club hangout like gangsters. And it just was, it was crazy. I go work that after the shift downstairs and I'd make tips downstairs if I made $30, that was a lot.

I go upstairs in the club and I'd walk out of the club with 300, $400 in tips on these gangsters music playing and I'm shucking oysters bar back and I'm working on and it just I remember I do it Friday, Saturday, Sunday night. And through the weekend, I'd make a thousand dollars.

Wow. 15 years old and I'd spend it all that next because I knew I was going, Kevin, we'll make it again. Yeah. And my mom used to get mad at me. She's you got school tomorrow. She didn't want me to work on Sunday night. She's you got school tomorrow. You can't work. And my father's let them alone, let them work.

And I never had a problem waking up. I was always an early riser even to this day. And like I do it and I go to school the next day on that Monday. And sometimes we cut school on Tuesday or Wednesday and we be in center city shop and buy and sweatsuit, you go to South Philly, tuxedo the Adidas or the Nike sweatsuits.

Yeah, I for sure. And like crazy times I remember we'd save up two or three weeks and then we'd have money to go get a house, rent a house down the shore in Wildwood for the summer. We'd all put in 1,015 hundred a piece and rent a house for the summer and just go down the shore for the summer to come home on a week.

I was like, I'd come home and I'd work. Get those tips and then go back down Monday, Thursday, Friday, man. Yeah, she has some good times. Yeah. South Philly, man. Those were the days.

Eli Kulp: [01:19:30] Yeah. I bet. I bet. Good man.