Eric And Ryan Berley Of The Franklin Fountain

The Philadelphia Inquire

Ryan and Eric Berley are owners of The Franklin Fountain. Drizzled with drollery and sprinkled with the forgotten flavors of the American past, the Franklin Fountain is a beloved handmade ice cream and candy shop at the corner of Market and Letitia Streets in Old City, Philadelphia.

Growing up in the quintessential small town of Media, PA, the Berley family's love of antiquing instilled in Ryan and Eric an appreciation for history and craftsmanship that has made The Franklin Fountain a national favorite of the slow food movement for 17 years.  

On this episode, Eli and the Berley Brothers discuss the challenges and payoffs of crafting three businesses handmade in nature: from Victorian costumes and honeycomb made on the roof to A2 cows and innovations sweeping the dairy industry today. 

More info at www.franklinfountain.com, shanecandies.com, franklinicecream.com 

Eric And Ryan Berley Of The Franklin Fountain

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Everyone [00:02:00] Eli here. Welcome back to the chef radio podcast. This week, we have a couple of really great guys in the studio with us. Um, you know, I got, I was able to wrangle on quick notice, Eric and Ryan Burley, uh, of the Franklin fountain fame. Uh, they are, uh, friends, neighbors, and also, um, I would say I'm one of the biggest fans and you know what I really like about these guys, you'll hear us talk about it throughout the podcast is their commitment to the craft.

Like [00:02:30] these guys, you're not going to find anyone more dedicated to making sure that you know, their customers are experiencing, you know, this sort of. Enveloping moment when you're, you're at their stores and you either walk into Shane's confectionary, either candy shop, or you go to the Franklin fountain where you're going to experience, um, you know, these people dressed in period clothing from the 1930s and like the original, uh, soda jerk outfits.

And, you know, you're going to experience the smells of the waffle [00:03:00] cones, uh, you know, that sort of energy around their, the, the, the long lines, which you know, which is a nuisance sometimes if you're in a hurry, but I tell you what people wait in line for this stuff for a reason, it is a real deal. There's, they're sourcing out of some of the most incredible dairy producers here in the Pennsylvania region.

They're making sure that, you know, they're doing their best to. You know, uh, have sustainable and ethical products with sugar, whether it's a cocoa beans, you know, whatever, wherever it's coming from, you [00:03:30] know, that traceability factor, which is really important to so many people these days and becoming more and more important as a consumer.

Um, you know, I'm always looking at that as a, as a, uh, important integral part of where I choose to spend my money and, you know, choices matter. We've talked about that before in the show where, you know, it's so important for people to understand that if you purchase something, you are supporting that. And if they're not doing the right thing, if they're not, uh, ensuring that their product is fair trade, [00:04:00] you know, whatever it is that, that you're, that you support, um, you know, you're giving your money and supporting, uh, that cause.

And, you know, I think we all remember the movie blood diamond, right? Where, you know, people are losing their lives and their lives, their livelihoods over. Yeah, somebody has, it's something like a diamond, but that's what happens with food too. So it's where our food is, is, comes from around the world, whether it's South America, Africa, um, you know, Europe, uh, third world countries, [00:04:30] you know, uh, or shirts or t-shirts, whatever it is, you know, we're supporting, um, you know, where, you know, wherever we purchase from.

So the guys at Franklin found Ryan and Eric, you know, they're, they're just such special individuals. And, uh, they're really, uh, we should be really proud to have them here in Philadelphia. So I recommend anybody who hasn't been there, you know, go out and support them and anybody who's listening. I know you're already thinking I gotta go visit.

So, uh, without further ado, just to get to the podcast as always, [00:05:00] thanks for listening. Um, you know, it does reviews. As many as you can, if you haven't reviewed the show already, please do it does matter. It does help the show get sort of a greater audience, a greater listenership. And as we grow this show, um, you know, I've been, I've been thankful for all of you involved.

So, um, enjoy the listen, uh, whether you're commuting, whether you're doing your laundry, whatever it is. Um, let's get to the podcast.

[00:05:30] This is the chef radio podcast

each week. Groundbreaking chef talks, 

Eric Berley: [00:05:40] chef talks, uh, chef, chef cooking, 

Eli Kulp: [00:05:44] hospitality, environment 

Eric Berley: [00:05:46] food. Is that really 

Eli Kulp: [00:05:48] what it stands for? I never really knew that Liberty is straight from the minds of the people who shaped the way we eat. It's hard to believe the possibility of food we're going to discuss.

These talks, [00:06:00] these ideas and more on the chef radio 

Eric Berley: [00:06:03] podcast.

All 

Eli Kulp: [00:06:09] right, everybody. Welcome back to the chef radio podcast. We are in the radio kismet studios here in the spring arts section of Philadelphia. I have two really great guests in front of me right now. Uh, we have Ryan and Eric Burley, uh, famous for the Franklin fountain here in Philadelphia, as well as Shane's candy located down there in old city.

What's up, [00:06:30] gentlemen? How are you today? 

Eric Berley: [00:06:31] Wow, good to be here. Thanks for having us. Thank you so 

Ryan Berley: [00:06:34] much, chef we're, uh, we're honored and privileged. 

Eli Kulp: [00:06:38] Listen, guys privileges all mine. Uh, you've been on my, you've been on my list for a while. Uh, as I worked through that list and I think, you know, we're at the beginning of summer, w what's a better time to talk about sweets, ice cream, frozen desserts, everything that you guys have done and, and continue to do so well at your, uh, old city establishment here in Philadelphia, uh, [00:07:00] for the listeners full disclosure, uh, in this Ima both a supporter friend and neighbor to, uh, these guys, I live, uh, about 50 feet from the Franklin fountain.

Uh, I walk out my door and I see the line. I smell the, uh, the waffle cones being made in the morning. I have to, uh, tell my son, at least 10 times a weekend. We can't have it again. We just had Franklin [00:07:30] fountain. So it's a constant battle. Um, you know, as a father and also the fact that, uh, I also want it more than once a weekend, uh, that I have to have sort of battle my own demons, uh, as the, as the smell of fresh waffle cones, kind of whiffed into the air as we pass by in the morning.

So guys, uh, it's, it's been a, um, it's been so good getting to know both of you over the years and seeing your, your real commitment to the craft. [00:08:00] You know, Eric, uh, you know, rye, we both geeked that. We've all geeked out a little bit about, you know, how important it is to support craftsmanship and the people that are really, um, You know, uh, sacrificing even potential successes, um, or, or more money, or, you know, a higher percentage to the bottom line, uh, to make sure that we're not only putting out great product, uh, but we're also supporting the people that should be supported.

We're going out of [00:08:30] our way to find products that are exceptional. Um, and in your case, we're talking about cocoa beans and you're talking about cream, you're talking about sugars, you're talking about all these different things. So gentlemen, I just want to say, um, I'm honored to be your guys' neighbor and I love that.

So, uh, I'm super excited to have you both in here. I'll get off my soap box. Thank you. 

Ryan Berley: [00:08:53] Thank you. Um, or blushing, we feel the same way. Uh, chef we've [00:09:00] we've really enjoyed our relationship both as friends and neighbors, but as really as food contemporaries here in the great city of brotherly love this scene that we have here.

Eli Kulp: [00:09:12] Yeah. It's it's awesome. So, uh, I, I said, I know you guys, but I don't know everything. Right. Like, um, and this was so great about this podcast because I'll bring in people that I know as a, as a colleague, as a chef or a, you know, somebody and, um, but there's always more to [00:09:30] learn, you know, there's always more to learn.

There's deeper, uh, you know, that sort of origin story that we go into and I want to know, like, where did you guys kind of grow up? Like where did, um, where'd you grow up? Like, what's your, what's your memory of kind of growing up and your relationship to sweeten ice cream and summertime. Probably once you go.

Yeah, we, 

Ryan Berley: [00:09:49] uh, we grew up in the little Norman Rockwell town of media, Pennsylvania. Okay. Um, it's actually called, uh, everybody's hometown and there's a trolley that runs [00:10:00] through it. And in 1976, um, right as I was being born, our mother decided to open in the antique store in the front room of our home. And, uh, she and our father called it the Saturday evening experience.

So it was very much an ode to Americana. Um, they, they actually collected and cutting framed up Saturday evening post magazines. So from an early age, we had this sort of window [00:10:30] into American, um, small town businesses. Um, we were raised traveling around the country, visiting these kinds of places. And even to the point where they designed a, a soda fountain in our, uh, dining room with our parents' collection of antique soda found the stock.

So, you know, I guess the Apple doesn't fall far from 

Eli Kulp: [00:10:58] them. Right. I [00:11:00] guess not. And Eric, like, what was that, what does that memory of having. Probably the only antique soda fountain within a, a thousand mile radius in your home. Um, what 

Eric Berley: [00:11:12] was that? Well, um, it, it was just part of the fabric. It's, it's your normal, right?

Whatever you grow up with, that's just normal. And there was, um, like a little counter that was made a marble, uh, you know, by the sink. I think, um, [00:11:30] in the seventies Victoriana was kind of a theme and all the rage, um, And actually Ryan, um, being four years older would often do these book reports. And of course, um, I was, you know, being the younger brother, I was always looking up to him and, uh, one of them he was interested in was, uh, Milton Hershey.

And so I, I remember, um, kind of [00:12:00] following in his footsteps, his interest in, in Milton Hershey. And, and then I in fourth grade dressed up as Milton, uh, with the caramel cart, from my, from our mothers, uh, antiques. That's nice to tell the story of Milton as well, caramel man, um, you know, before he, you know, made it big and chocolate.

So, you know, we were paying attention to each other, um, from an early age. And, uh, that, [00:12:30] that for me really just. You know, making food, um, just smelling baked goods with my grandmother, um, when she would, when she was alive and with us, um, that was really special. Like hospitality, warmth, um, love and food was just something I just couldn't get enough of.

And, uh, that's that was really on and early on in childhood. 

Eli Kulp: [00:12:59] Cool. So hold [00:13:00] on. So when did you dress up as Milton Hershey? Is this like a Halloween thing or was this just like for one of the Saturday night you get together? 

Eric Berley: [00:13:06] This was for fourth grade, like book report. Oh, well, like in front of people and in, you know, roastery elementary school in media, I was carting carting around all these individually wrapped caramels and passing them along to people's desks back, you know, up and down the aisle.

Eli Kulp: [00:13:26] Wow. So you had some good friends that day, for sure. I bet. [00:13:30] That's awesome. Yeah. And that, 

Ryan Berley: [00:13:32] that sort of touches, I would say on a kind of a family love for kind of dressing, dressing up and playing a role, particularly historical role. That's something that we always sort of liked to do. We had a costume room in the attic of our family's Victorian house, which is like every kid's dream.

Wow. And so I think that also, you could see where that translates later in life too, to what we do [00:14:00] online. 

Eli Kulp: [00:14:00] Yeah, absolutely. Um, if you've never had the pleasure of meeting, uh, Ryan and Eric, uh, on the street or in their stores, um, you can kind of get them with, you know, as right now the boat tie, the sort of, I don't know, how would you describe.

The sort of throwback to the forties, fifties, I guess. I it's amazing. I mean, you look like proprietors from, you know, a century ago, but you know, decades [00:14:30] ago. 

Eric Berley: [00:14:30] Yeah. We're, we're sporting boaters right now. And I think it's supposed to be a hundred degrees and humidity today. Um, but I wouldn't be caught in a hat otherwise.

Eli Kulp: [00:14:41] Exactly. No. I mean, um, yes, you guys really just hearing that ties it all together because what do people get to experience when they walk into one of your stores? What are you, what, what is the experience that you want them to, to, to have, uh, I know walking into your stores now, it's things have changed since [00:15:00] COVID a lot of people can't experience the inside of Franklin fountain right now, which is a shame cause that's part of the allure of, or what you're doing.

Um, but what do you want people to experience. 

Ryan Berley: [00:15:11] That, uh, very much was the intention. Uh, chef was to create a, an early 20th century soda fountain experience, uh, with the architecture of the building in mind, the materials, as Eric mentioned, the feel of cold marble on a hot summer day, [00:15:30] um, the real wire back chairs and, and to be served by a soda jerk, um, which was the old fashioned term for, for the, uh, the clerk.

So to speak the guy's, the jerk, the jerk, the fountain heads. So, um, a full body authentic experience that, uh, that you can then taste as the, kind of the final culmination. That's always what we've really 

Eli Kulp: [00:15:57] strove for. I mean, [00:16:00] you can't deny the fact that when you go in there, Uh, or see it from the outside even is that you guys have thought about every little detail of what that experience is like for the guests.

And it's not just coming and getting great ice cream, um, great ice cream bars, whatever it is. But the meticulous detail to what you're doing is, is part of it is [00:16:30] a big part of it, I believe. And I think that's, you know, you're getting great ice cream and great flavors, all that, but that's, what's setting you guys apart and it has right.

And your brand, I believe I talked to you Ryan about this, that our, sorry, Eric, um, you know, the, just the fact that. You know, the brand that you guys have and so strong, uh, and people will just love it. I think it's just, it's really amazing. I'm always, I'm always fascinated by that. Uh, if you haven't been there, um, expect to, you know, [00:17:00] have some patients and you're going to sort of wait in the line typically, unless you're, you know, here on a Monday afternoon around, uh, I'd say about 3:00 PM might be a good shot to get in there quickly right now.

Uh, but the, uh, you know, there's, there is a, there is that buzz around what you guys have done and you haven't done it loudly. You've done it sort of organically, I think. And, and that's the best, best way to do it. Um, you know, what was that, what was that the first, when you. [00:17:30] When you started decided to open this thing and you went to those first motions of building it, and then you started, you know, you opened the doors, what was the initial reaction?

Uh, and this was going back to 2006, seven. Is that what 2004 is when you as a member. Okay. And what was that? What was I, firstly, that, that initial sort of a rush in the beginning of opening and getting open. And then, and then for [00:18:00] customers immediately, there was a big splash where you immediately a sensation or did it take time?

Eric Berley: [00:18:06] Well, the first night, I mean, of course the bathroom hadn't been finished, painted there's tape painter's tape that hadn't been taken off the walls. I think our aunt was, um, had finished. Hadn't finished. Um, we hired a guy, uh, the day before to, uh, Clean the windows. We thought that was novel. That [00:18:30] there'd be people in Philadelphia to, to pay cash, to clean windows.

That was, we were suburbanites. We were coming to the big city. So this was not just a family venture. This was a complete transformation of a suburban family doing something in the city. It was like learning about the city and the rhythms of first Fridays and old city and all that. And there was a bit of, [00:19:00] um, anticipation.

We had had blankets and covered the windows. We, we wanted to create a sense of something fun. That was, we were going to reveal and there were glass jars, uh, filled with colored water as the old pharmacies had. And, um, And, and open. And I think our dad and our mom were our first employees, uh, dad was taken care of the register and we had never really scooped ice [00:19:30] cream.

It was like, it was like, like nothing can really prepare you for, you know, having a child may be able to go to class, but really you have to experience it yourself. And, um, what that, what that feels like is something has been taken out of us and now it's living into the world, 

Eli Kulp: [00:19:57] right? Yeah. That's amazing.

Yeah. [00:20:00] Starting to businesses very much like. Having a child? 

Ryan Berley: [00:20:04] Well, I definitely, I felt like as soon as we opened the doors, we've been on a bucking Bronco of ever since. I mean, it was a wild ride, uh, particularly for the first five years. Um, it was intense. I mean, we, we, we worked 14 hour days or more every, every day for five years, uh, we [00:20:30] lived, both lived above the business, moved down there, left media and lands down where we were living.

And, uh, you know, as Eric said, we hadn't even scooped ice cream. So I remember the first night we were trying to make waffles and make, I remember my first root beer float. I dropped the ice cream in there. The root beer or the Coke rather just overflowed on the floor. It was like, Oh, okay. I'm not going to do that again.

Eli Kulp: [00:20:56] It's so hectic. Right. 

Ryan Berley: [00:20:59] So it's [00:21:00] just like, we'd never done any of this stuff and really how hard could it be? Well, it's not making, you know, scooping ice cream and making milkshakes is not that hard in and of itself, but, you know, managing this, this thing that really like the lines just grew and grew and grew.

And, uh, our response to it, I would say was organic because we didn't really know any better. And there was no, there was no playbook either. We weren't [00:21:30] like a restaurant. Exactly. And we were in a coffee 

Eric Berley: [00:21:32] shop. Yeah. We had like paper calendars, uh, that we were writing. You would write the schedule of which shift leaders or, you know, in a small box, two inches by two inches for the day.

And that's kind of how it was all done on. You know, the menu was created on a napkin at the street at the bar. And, um, it, then we learned about, Oh, uh, online platform for scheduling and what, [00:22:00] what the, all those, th those reliefs that, that would, um, help during the growing pains. And I remember our first thousand dollar day was new year's Eve.

It was like, Oh my, Oh gosh, we resold a thousand dollars in one day. And it was, it was, it was unbelievable, uh, feeling and, you know, there were there, there were days of just feeling down in the dumps, 

Eli Kulp: [00:22:28] right. Overwhelmed. [00:22:30] I'm sure. 

Eric Berley: [00:22:31] Um, you know, horrible hurricanes that have come through boarding up the building, um, being, you know, being robbed.

Um, it's, it's just been, it's been an experience of all, all of humanity, you know, all the emotions and, um, the good and the bad, and, you know, a big piece in 20, uh, Oh eight was when Adam Richmond came and [00:23:00] featured the Mount Vesuvius Sunday on his show. And it was a man vs food. And that was one of many shows, but that was like, that was an, a plus in terms of impact, it made on our whole company.

We just couldn't believe that was a weight that was like a tidal wave that, that brought. So it's really been a process of waves. I would say, yeah, 

Eli Kulp: [00:23:26] we're the haymaker thrown in there every once in a while. 

[00:23:30] Eric Berley: [00:23:30] And, and, and I remember, I remember, uh, when you got best chef in Philadelphia, right. And, um, was that, what was that?

20, uh, 

Eli Kulp: [00:23:42] must have been 13 or something. 

Eric Berley: [00:23:44] There was a wage, there was a wave there that, you know, you were ushering in this whole, this Philadelphia was a good investment for chefs to move to and tourism was starting, you know, hotels were popping. And, um, so [00:24:00] that there have been these waves throughout the last, um, 

Eli Kulp: [00:24:04] to believe almost 20 years, almost 20 years.

That's insane. Yeah. Since I'm sure it's been close to that since conception. Yeah. Um, I mean, the idea of going from. You know your backgrounds, right. So you're a history major. I am correct. And Eric you're in, um, philosophical, um, that direction, uh, philosophy. [00:24:30] Um, did you guys start of go essentially right into entrepreneurship or was this a, um, did you get out of school and work a little bit in your own sort of, uh, careers or was this something that, um, those degrees didn't really go too far, too far forward, as far as, um, sort of what they were initially intended for?

I'm sure you've used them over the years, but, uh, in certain, certain ways, but, um, how has that, like, how old were you [00:25:00] guys when you guys sort of started doing this? 

Ryan Berley: [00:25:02] Um, so I guess I was in my mid twenties and I really always had an entrepreneurial. Streak since being a child. So during college, I ran my own mail order, antiques business, and I set up its shows.

So I was kind of always, you know, scrappy selling stuff. Yeah. And then I went [00:25:30] to work for Freeman's auction cause I was really looking towards, uh, making antiques at full-time career. And I did that for five or six years and I learned a lot at Freemans. Freemans is America's oldest auction house. Nice family run, amazing place.

I mean, I got to handle and disassembled Benjamin Franklin desk. Wow. Um, among other treasures. So you get to learn, I really cut my teeth on kind of the [00:26:00] finer points of Americana and Freemans and. And then at the same time, I, this, this entrepreneurial itch is always been there. So wanting to really strike out on my own, whether it would be with antiques or something else, it always feels in the antiques world that things, people who were into antiques kind of know each other.

And it's, it's a smaller world, you know, like anything, but [00:26:30] the public loves antiques. The general populace loves history. They want to connect with these things. There's family heirlooms. And so I think that was always part of my idea was how to, how to bring history and objects to a larger audience. 

Eli Kulp: [00:26:46] Yeah.

And, um, you know, you guys have done that. Um, very clearly. Uh, what are the fun tidbits that you, um, I've learned from you guys, just, [00:27:00] you know, cause you, you really sort of follow the, uh, the history and how you, um, you know, showcase your ice cream and, you know, the ice cream being held in the, in the cartons, which people, most people would, would say it was Chinese food containers.

Right. Um, that we all know it's ubiquitous and Chinese food, the, the white cartons of the wire handle, but the fine print on that, you know, it says that this was the original, um, holder for ice cream. Um, you know, if you weren't using [00:27:30] a cone, um, like those little tidbits are, are what makes, you know, the devil's in the details, right?

So those little tidbits of information that you guys provide, uh, historically as something I just love and I gobble that up because it's, it is exactly what you said. People do have a fondness for, um, you know, sort of remembering or respecting the history. And, you know, even for me, As a chef when I first came down to Philadelphia being that I'm not from here [00:28:00] originally, or even in Pennsylvania, but my family's heritage is in Pennsylvania and being able to explore sort of the historical aspects of cuisine and be able to translate that into some of my own food.

That was something that I always thought was, um, I just really enjoy that, that process and that sort of creative, um, progression through, you know, the different aspects of the different foods throughout the, uh, the state and, and sort of [00:28:30] general region. And it's it's, I always felt if you can connect somebody, uh, to the food other than just the food.

So whether it's historical reference, something that, that sort of plays, um, you know, references a different time, period, you know, something that makes it stick and memorable. Is that it's, it's like, it's like adding just another level of, you know, the sixth sense, so to speak in, in food and, and allows people to kind of remember it and sort of, [00:29:00] it, it sort of stays in their memory bank a lot longer and you guys, uh, achieve that, uh, thoroughly.

So, um, you know, the, the antique aspect of, of what you're talking about, and I'd love to know. I mean, this area's is rich in, um, sort of heirlooms and antiques. What kind of things, what kind of objects do you have in your inf in the Franklin, [00:29:30] uh, fountain or more specifically, I'm going here to the Shane's confectionary, which we haven't really talked about, um, which is a whole nother conversation with the, uh, the candies and your producer.

What kind of objects do you guys. Use do you have in that you're really proud of, um, throughout the business, 

the 

Eric Berley: [00:29:50] whole building, uh, all of the buildings really are, um, situated on a really historic block. So I think understanding what [00:30:00] came before, even before we even think about what's inside the buildings, um, there's a phenomenal, uh, statue of chief Tammany, um, who was, you know, the, the chief of the lone Island opera, just down the street at the corner, at the corner of market and front.

Um, just speaking to the depth of what came before, um, thousands of years of native Americans, um, [00:30:30] and a peaceful nation, um, And a place that was in harmony with, uh, the soil and the land and the air, um, the waters. And that was really, uh, that, that first block, which being a historic printing block from the colonial period, uh, sets a stage for, uh, that set a stage for American America's revolution [00:31:00] against the British, that set a stage for, um, the printing of common sense and many other literary, um, pieces, uh, the printing of America's first, new and old Testament bound together in.

On one of the sites that we house cocoa beans. Um, so it's, you have to kind of step back almost to, to realize the framework, um, [00:31:30] for what we're doing is all of that. Yeah. 

Ryan Berley: [00:31:34] And I would say one of the objects that speaks to that, that we were really sort of thinking about was we have busts of Benjamin Franklin that look over the soda fountain and Franklin's life was very much an inspiration to us.

Um, his entrepreneurial spirit and in 2006, there was a 300 celebration of his, of [00:32:00] what would have been his birthday. So we got into the fever of that and we both. Learned a lot about Franklin who printed across the street, by the way. Wow. And many people don't know this, but Franklin's actual print shop was where the SEPTA station is.

Eli Kulp: [00:32:18] Uh, wait, wait to, uh, you know, keep that in our, our history, right. That's right. Buses, uh, land. 

Ryan Berley: [00:32:25] So giving it the flavor of Ben [00:32:30] Franklin kind of thematically, um, mixed with marble soda fountains from our mother's antique store, like literally there was a marble fountain in her antique shop in the basement.

And that was probably the first piece that we got. And it was like a $2,000 things. So once we bought that, it was like, all right, there's no turning back now. Plus the thing is 12 foot long and solid marble. 

Eli Kulp: [00:32:54] Wow. Is that still in. Uh, Franklin Sutton. 

Ryan Berley: [00:32:59] Yeah, [00:33:00] yeah, yeah. Those things go outlive all of us. Yeah. 

Eric Berley: [00:33:04] So say at Shane confectionary, um, when we took over and did some renovations, uh, we discovered, um, the original floor, uh, like the beautiful yellow pine floors.

Um, there were pieces of Chestnut wood that we re-engaged into, uh, what is now our chocolate cafe, uh, [00:33:30] in the back a little that space. And it's, you know, just, uh, it's just, uh, a confection in terms of painted, um, decorative. Would work on in the cases, the blues and the blue and white cases. And we had, uh, a chance to repair some tin work and, um, the tin ceilings and a lot of things actually were coming out of [00:34:00] storage to restore the back of the candy shop.

The old copper kettles on the second floor were engaged, um, for cooking. We, we started the chimneys again and venting out the old chimneys. Um, so there's. Like maple floors that we work on, we work on wood, stand on wood  so it's, it's just as important to think about [00:34:30] what our customers experience, as it is to think about what our staff experiences, um, we like natural light.

We like windows. Um, they need to be restored often. Um, but the, the benefit of being in nature or having some element of a natural space, people like to work in it. 

Eli Kulp: [00:34:54] Nice. And I mean, your employees, I mean, they're, um, you know, [00:35:00] they're daunting, you know, the, the period clothing, if you will, as well, you know, which is just another element of the, the experience, um, and you know, really, really allowing people to feel like they've, they've fully stepped back.

Uh, into, uh, in different time periods. So what are, I mean, besides ice cream, uh, and, um, you know, sort of general sort of confectionary is give me a list of the things that you guys produce. [00:35:30] Um, I know you've been to bar, you know, all of that. You're doing all those candies. What else? What are the things that you guys are doing all the time?

And, you know, it's a little Willy Wonka S because you'd behind those doors, you don't really know what's 

Eric Berley: [00:35:44] going on. Okay. Well, we're making ice cream just about every day. Um, throughout the year, uh, we have three ice cream machines, and we have people making our, our [00:36:00] kitchen staff, making the ingredients that go into that ice cream, like, um, honeycomb pieces or hot fudge in the copper kettles at Shane.

And the 

Eli Kulp: [00:36:11] honeycomb is. Yeah. So if it's very from your 

Eric Berley: [00:36:14] rooftop. Yes. So we have a couple of beehive, a few beehives, uh, operated by Don Schomp of Philadelphia bee company. Um, and that honey actually has become exclusive in, uh, some of our honey honey tasting kits for the chocolate. [00:36:30] And, um, just for in jar form, um, we outgrew the roof, so to speak Eli in terms of our honey, we now we outsource that the Chester County bees for the honeycomb ice cream.

Um, so it's, uh, baked goods, uh, like pies in the fall. We're doing pretty much chocolate chip cookies and brownies year round, um, at the fountain soda syrups year round about eight to 12 [00:37:00] SERPs making all your own syrup, making those. And root beer is our number one flavor for our root beer floats as an example.

Eli Kulp: [00:37:09] Um, do you make that like from a recipe from of different sort of natural natural ingredients? Yeah. I'm, 

Eric Berley: [00:37:17] I'm, I'm proud to say that was a recipe. Ryan developed, um, really coming up with his, his interest in flavor profile, knowing a little more of what he wanted, which was kind of a bite ear, [00:37:30] root beer, um, something with, with kick that would balance the sweet and creaminess of vanilla, um, and some flavorings use botanicals and fresh, uh, or dried fruits.

Some recipes, uh, we, we doctor something that's available to us. That's a natural, natural flavor. Right. Um, so we're making ice, the ice cream department kind of is kind of [00:38:00] constantly going. Yep. However, uh, the chocolate department also is constantly going now with, within Shane confectionary. It's sort of like, uh, um, roasting beans, sorting beans, um, conching, the, the cocoa nibs and the sugar, turning it into block aging, the block tempering the block, making it into liquid chocolate that, uh, can [00:38:30] be put into confections.

And the bars into ice cream bars can be made into, um, Specialty bond bonds, right? So there's, uh, at least at least 16 floors of activity, um, that I can remember. And, uh, there's there's people and just about all of them, uh, working, but, but there's a seasonal element to the ice cream business and there's a [00:39:00] seasonal element to chocolate confections chocolate confections is largely, um, Christmas and Easter holiday centered sales.

However, you know, doing a chocolate, uh, virtual tasting, uh, is going to be something that people could do year round for their business, his class. 

Eli Kulp: [00:39:21] Yeah. And, uh, I mean, It's it's an intense operation. You guys are running and, and, you know, outside looking in, I think it's easy to be like, [00:39:30] Oh yes, ice cream shop, how, you know, how crazy can it be?

But when you see the activity around there every morning with ice cream going, they're picking up, they're dropping off, you know, loads of milk from a, you know, from a specific farm, you know, there's, there's a lot going into it. And, you know, your, your staff has always pleasant and, and it's always a, it's always a nice interaction to see for sure.

Um, what are, what are some of the critical challenges, uh, that are more specific to kind of [00:40:00] running a business like yours? Um, Ryan speak to like, you know, the, obviously there's seasonal challenges, but what are the, what are the other challenges that they kind of come, come with owning this type of business?

Ryan Berley: [00:40:13] Oh, you, you just sort of said it. Um, I think in a nutshell, just hearing Eric, uh, talk about all of the things that we're doing and then you're. You're kind of reflecting about what goes on behind the curtain. It is, it is intense. It's a lot, it's [00:40:30] very ambitious. Um, we're, we're perpetually creative and our staff is also perpetually creative and the business went well beyond Eric and I, the moment we opened the tea, when we first hired our first, uh, staff members.

So we're always on one hand trying to keep kind of the creativity and keep the, kind of the juiciness alive [00:41:00] for everyone involved. Um, but we're trying to pay the bills and we. We've taken out a lot of debt to do what we do. Um, we own our bricks, thankfully. Um, so it's really a long game that we've played as far as the business end.

And I think the challenge is, is that we set out to create a business that was handmade in nature from [00:41:30] everything, from the menus and that they core to the products and, um, the costumes. So inherently that is going to require a lot more people. Right. It's, it's a, it's a labor intensive business. And in today's world, uh, you mentioned the labor crisis.

That's a serious thing, uh, for us, um, for sure. Um, the recognition of, [00:42:00] um, You know, a living wage is something that we're working towards, um, across all of our departments. And we are challenged by just kind of the financial piece, um, because we're in a world that is going increasingly mechanized. Yes. Even more so, um, as labor costs, rise and other costs.

So how do we balance a handmade [00:42:30] business that sort of modeled on something from the 19th century? Yeah. Right. Because the same point, I would say we've been very thankful that our customers have been with us and have been willing to kind of pay the price. Um, for the quality and the experience, and we have amazing staff members who have been dedicated to the craft themselves [00:43:00] to learning new things.

And frankly, you can get experiences working with us that you can't find anywhere else in, certainly in Philadelphia, maybe not a whole country. Right. And so that's part of the price they pay maybe for not as high of, of, um, you know, a salary, but they get to make hard candy from the Victorian period. It's super cool.

Eli Kulp: [00:43:22] Right?

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landscape of any business. Always shifting, always evolving, um, you know, from year to year, from day to day, what are [00:45:30] some of the, the ways that you guys continue to stay relevant? Um, you know, there's people doing, you know, crazy ice cream flavors and bacon, egg, and cheese ice cream, there's people doing, you know, whatever you can shove into, um, into an ice cream and make it as, almost as, um, Instagrammable as possible.

Um, you know, and that sort of. That, that kind of world at that's sort of spun off. How do [00:46:00] you guys continue to make sure that your products relevant, what you're doing is relevant and staying, but yet staying true to what you are and who you are as humans, because this is a very personal experience and expression of the two of you.

Eric Berley: [00:46:16] It actually, I wanted to mention one other challenge that kind of relates here, um, unique to our business is that we're both, um, we're both sort of a historical business as well as a [00:46:30] confectionary business. And when you add those two, um, ingredients, so to speak, um, given the cultural lens through which everything is being, um, inspected confectionery has been historically a very dirty.

Business. And it is actually globally, still today with, um, things like child labor and, [00:47:00] uh, Western Africa and, uh, other other, um, things that we just don't want our business to be part of. 

Eli Kulp: [00:47:07] These are like example, like sugar harvesting, cocoa, bean harvesting, like those type of that, you know, cause a lot of the, you know, cocoa beans are coming from, you know, whether the Dominican Republic, Haiti, um, Ecuador, you know, um, Africa, you know, so is that, is that kind of what you're referring to fall of following the sort of 

Eric Berley: [00:47:27] traceability disability and supply [00:47:30] chain, um, ethics.

And, but if you look back in the history, uh, the Quakers actually historically also were, um, very interested in, uh, the free trade movement, um, in their, in the opening shops. And so. Fair trade. Isn't just a modern idea. This has gone back in, um, in different, uh, ways here in Philadelphia, particularly with the [00:48:00] Quakers.

Uh, Ryan's a Quaker. Um, and, and, uh, we're both, we're both Christians and we, um, we do think about like, how do we, uh, how do we address these challenges in a modern, in a realm, in a way that's relevant and that, uh, can be dealing with the supply chain decisions, um, and knowing that we won't, uh, that we have to sort of, um, [00:48:30] bring our customers forward in, in the Y.

Um, so for us is for me is like asking, um, what am I committed to and why, um, throughout all these changes and without. Complete certainty. Um, given a lot of unknowns, what am I committed to? And, um, the business's mission is to delight customers is delight our staff and is really to delight [00:49:00] ourselves. And we need to make sure we create space that we're living in alignment with our values as really a unique, but universal challenge.

Everyone has to do that should, should strive to do that. And being able to pause a bit, um, with, with COVID has kind of given us a chance to ask some of those questions, what are our values and where, where does that, how does that affect our decisions that we 

[00:49:30] Eli Kulp: [00:49:30] listen? I mean, those, those things, it is, you know, as an entrepreneur and you know, when people, we've all, we've all had our own businesses and been a part of owning.

Um, which owning business always sounds so amazing. And there are some definite perks of, you know, being your own boss and owning a restaurant or in this case, a jail confectionary business. But there are, there are real challenges of [00:50:00] having to decide, is this a business decision or is this a moral decision?

And there are times when you come across a dilemma, right? Like you want to buy this product and you want to support this farmer. However, that decision could have a true negative impact if you're not able to, you know, develop, you know, get their revenue to reflect that, that, um, that idea, that [00:50:30] sort of thought process, you know, the, uh, the sort of reason why you're doing it.

Are there. Do you, are there instances where, you know, either of you have really sort of come up against Sally, is this, is this for the love or is this for the business? And if there are, do you have any examples? Yeah. 

Eric Berley: [00:50:49] I mean, uh, you know, when you, when you get to work with different people that you're going to, um, you're going to learn about where they [00:51:00] have flexibility and where they don't.

And, um, if you want something out of it that they're just not able to do for you, um, that, that means you have to start looking elsewhere. Um, and sometimes that is the case because they're just too busy or they're, um, they're too old and they don't want to change their ways or think differently. [00:51:30] Um, so, so for me, I've been.

This is a dairy journey that I've been on recently. 

Eli Kulp: [00:51:40] That's exactly where I was going. So thank you. Thank you for going there 

Eric Berley: [00:51:44] in 2018, the Penn state ice cream class. And I was really interested because our supplier has, um, suggested that they may not be able to, um, continue to support us. And so I [00:52:00] wanted to understand, I didn't want them to add an education on how this all works.

And in, in our buildings, um, dairy processing is just really tight. I mean, our spaces are really tight and we just chose not to do the, the raw processing. We'd rather choose to buy from, uh, a processor, not directly from the farm, but a processor of dairies. And, uh, so that's just been a, um, [00:52:30] uh, Depending on how you look at it.

That's been an educational experience, um, from how milk powders can be off flavored and affect your ice cream, to understanding the genetics behind, uh, the different Calvin varieties that are out there to what the cows are consuming, um, who the farmers are, how much, how flexible the processors are. [00:53:00] And, um, 

Eli Kulp: [00:53:01] so can you walk me through, so the idea, you mentioned processors, so there's, there's, there's dairy from the cow coming in, and then that processor is sort of mixing specific to your sort of ice cream needs.

Is that, is that what this is? Right. And they're, they're developing a recipe along with you so that your ice cream bases reflect. Your values, what you want, the flavors of consistencies. Is that what this is 

Eric Berley: [00:53:29] out what that is? Yeah. [00:53:30] Yes. It's, it's considered an ice cream base and ours just happens to, we have to buy, um, uh, both a chocolate base and a plain base in which we flavor and, um, just given the way the business was going.

Um, we wanted to have a little more control of all the, of all the ingredients that went into the base. And quite honestly, I'm still on that journey. Um, I haven't arrived yet, [00:54:00] but the journey has been worth it because I've gained the education and I feel like I can, I can help someone else. Um, the, um, the industry has gotten so big.

Um, Oh my God. Yes. So, you know, the small regional processors are all out of business primarily and in, in Pennsylvania, which, you [00:54:30] know, claims to be the top fourth largest dairy state in the, in the country. Um, believe it or not, there's just not that much creativity going on. Um, I mean, it's just a lot of big and a lot of conventional and, um, there, I have found some amazing, um, people in, in the space in Southeast Pennsylvania and Maryland [00:55:00] Delaware, um, but really very, very few, um, what they call VAT pasteurizers in the state of New Jersey.

There's like two. Um, so just to give a sense of, um, processors have gone to. Um, more automation, less batch, um, more inline flow. So it's just bigger quantities that you have to be a bigger chain to even be their customer. Right. [00:55:30] So working with someone who wants to, for instance, work with our chocolate, um, when we're making it in small batches in Philadelphia, they have to be of a certain, um, mindset, uh, to, to believe in the values that we're, we're trying to, to work to bring to our customers are fully transparent and interested in supporting this type of agriculture.

But the S the, the challenge has been not too many processors [00:56:00] out there, and there are some, and they're amazing. Um, but the general public doesn't see the processor behind the grocery store, um, packaged goods. They don't understand how it works because right. To know how it works is to be a processor, right.

Eli Kulp: [00:56:17] That's interesting. I guess I've never, um, thought of it that way. And like you said, as things are more automated, they became more conventional is harder to do what you guys want to [00:56:30] do. It's harder for restaurants to do what they want to do. And any food business that there really is dedicated to the craft.

And the problem is that, you know, the more challenging it is to do things like what you're doing or other restaurants that are really, um, pushing boundaries. Um, the more, the less of these are gonna be. And, you know, I think we're all afraid of those days in the future when, um, You can't, it's going to be harder to find independent restaurants, independent [00:57:00] chefs, independent businesses that are doing the right thing, uh, farther and fewer between as, as America continues in that direction of, of quicker, faster, more convenient, um, you know, and, uh, more artificial.

It seems that sometimes, so it feels like you're always pushing back right against this sort of moving wall. Um, you know, what do you think your roles are as, as entrepreneur in business, especially in the ice cream, um, sort of landscape, because there [00:57:30] is this national, you talked about these conventions you go to and you told me about them and these other people that are really doing it.

What is, what is that sort of, how, how, what are you noticing, um, in, you know, people continuing to push for the craft? Like what you guys are doing versus trying to automate, make it faster, quicker, more efficient. Yeah. 

Ryan Berley: [00:57:52] It's interesting. I think what. Well, we've had to do, as you say, push back, um, is that you [00:58:00] kind of have to, you have to kind of go your own course and be a bit of a, a rebel.

Yeah. As to be a leader in the F in the food space. And as Eric mentioned about the dairy and the confectionary world, they're pretty conservative industries. They're steeped in history and they're steeped in tradition because they're traditional products, the customer like strawberry ice cream, because that's what they've had since they were [00:58:30] a kid and they want it to kind of maybe tastes like the kind they had when they were a kid too.

Eli Kulp: [00:58:35] So, which is often artificial and, and not really strawberry. Why 

Ryan Berley: [00:58:41] isn't my pistachio ice cream, bright green. Yeah. That, so you were up against some of that, um, And in a world that is increasingly mechanized and there's, I think it's been [00:59:00] challenging to connect the confectionary world to the food values world.

I think a lot of, um, chefs and makers are able to do it a little more successfully, um, because there's already a space like in the chocolate world, there's a whole space to talk about ethical chocolate or coffee. There's not that space in the ice cream industry. Like it doesn't, it doesn't occur. And I think if there's any movement that I've [00:59:30] seen, maybe Eric has more to say about this is that there's actually a lot of younger people are going non-dairy altogether vegan either for reasons of diet or.

For, um, moral or ethical choices. Sure. So I think that has been an interesting trend and we've definitely adjusted to that and are proud of our vegan ice creams that we're making. Um, but I [01:00:00] don't think 20 years ago that was, that was a speck on our heart. 

Eli Kulp: [01:00:06] Yeah. Yeah. It's interesting how, even the idea of people, you know, uh, having issue with lactose, like too much of it can leave your, leave your stomach in a, in a, in a hurting situation for a lot of people.

And, you know, I find myself, you know, going to like an open milk substitute if I'm putting it in a drink or something. Uh, [01:00:30] what, what kind of work are you guys doing behind the scenes as, as this. Continues to seem to evolve. And, you know, it's a, almost a billion dollar industry. I believe, you know, the non-dairy alternatives, um, for, you know, milk creamers or, or, or ice creams.

Is that something you, you put a lot of emphasis on, um, in conversations and, and talks about how do you stay true to the craft, but yet evolve at the time? 

Eric Berley: [01:00:58] I, yeah, for us, [01:01:00] um, I'm so excited about, um, when we launched the drinking chocolate, uh, glass court bottles with, in collaboration with Oasis Creamery, who's the, that stuff was 

Eli Kulp: [01:01:12] crazy.

Crazy, crazy. Good. What is it you're talking about? 

Eric Berley: [01:01:18] So the milk itself, uh, is a milk that I kind of discovered. I don't know if it was by accident or, um, called origin milk. And it's a [01:01:30] single herd of Guernsey, um, cows that are in honey Brook that are processed in, uh, rocks by Oasis Creamery. And it was so great.

It was like, I had finally found. The match that I was really looking forward to the supplier that was like, I couldn't find no one at Penn state, whatever, like be able to just point me in the direction. It took me like two and a half years to find. And in the middle of the pandemic, I met these [01:02:00] cows. I met Adrian, the CEO of origin milk, and I met the processor like, and he he's an Amish man that reminds me of a great jazz musician.

He can have like 12 different dairy products and brands going all at once. And he is, he's an example of scale, but also rooted in a traditional community, um, that, uh, milks, you know, raw, organic certified. But [01:02:30] he, he doesn't. He doesn't place judgment on the customer, whatever the customer wants. Great he'll work with it.

So we were able to bring our chocolate, um, mix to him and he was able to put it into the bottles and it was like, Oh, this huge relief, because I'm able to find like this outlet for the values aligned, uh, specialty products that we really wanted to get across. And not that our whole business has gone that way, but at [01:03:00] least I now know, I, we, we have some, we have a destination in which we can start to move, um, more of our conventional, um, ingredients over to that, um, that approach.

So it's been a, it's been a real sense of relief, um, and something I'm just really looking forward to in the future to, to grow that part of the business. 

Eli Kulp: [01:03:22] That's great. I mean, finding those, those, those, um, sort of collaborations. Such a fun [01:03:30] thing. You know what I mean? It's like a new farmer grow in a new vegetable or, or vegetables for you specific to you, or, you know, able to sort of help your business.

You know, so one plus one equals three mentality, you know, where, you know, this, the recognition of just the product, but also the, um, you know, they're giving you and your great product and mixing those two together and making something special that drinking chocolate, what was that? That was for like a, uh, like a, sort of a COVID like [01:04:00] packaged box.

I, the people that a lot of people were doing, right, that was like part of a purchase that you could do. And I thankfully, again, one of the perks about living close to them is that sometimes I get treats dropped off to me. Um, 

Eric Berley: [01:04:14] I had to, I had to, I had to share, you know, when you, when you have good news, you want to share, and those amazing stuff's made with eight to, uh, milk, which is unique and also to milk it's.

It's, uh, [01:04:30] it's really the, the cow, uh, that has the  protein as opposed to an one, um, tested protein in the milk and humans have a two, um, milk, uh, um, produce a two milk. And so it's more, um, easily digestible by by humans and the, the Amish and others in the progressive I'll call it. The dairy space are [01:05:00] exploring a to, uh, there's some fantastic.

If you just look up other 82 dairies, the entire breed of Guernsey is a two and a lot of jerseys are. So if, if the cows Brown, um, check and see, look for that eight too. Um, and that's coming from, uh, being. Being sons of a, of a doctor. I was always interested in, you know, the health and wellness side of, um, where food [01:05:30] and, and even confections fit into this, this space of like wellness and wholesomeness.

And I think, you know, just, just this dairy journey has shown me. There was a book called the, uh, the devil in the milk, um, that like, it's, uh, really got me thinking about, um, is this, is this true? Could this be true? Let's see the science. So check the science and, um, that, that I would [01:06:00] leave to you to look up and to try it, just see what raw milk would do in your body.

How does it. How does it present itself? Um, try a two milk and see if your body, um, reacts, like, because I think if you stay stuck and believing you're lactose intolerant, um, you'll never potentially, you're missing out on a potential opportunity to get back onto a delicious, wholesome food. Wow. 

Eli Kulp: [01:06:28] That's cool.

[01:06:30] Thank you for saying that. I mean, I, I think that's, um, I think Sony, I mean, you hear so many people now be like, Oh man, I want that ice cream, but you know, um, it just doesn't, you know, Not your specifically, but in general, like, you know, um, being concerned about it, a lot of people are willing to pay the price and I'm one of them sometimes, uh, to make sure that I have the ice cream in me, but, um, that's cool.

I didn't know that, and 

Eric Berley: [01:06:58] it's not exactly a [01:07:00] business or a moral decision. It's, it's kind of a nutritional decision, but it may have some side benefits. So we're sort of exploring how that might, whether or not we can do that with our custard. 

Eli Kulp: [01:07:14] Ask you the, what do you, what are farmers saying in general about this movement away from dairy?

Um, are there concerns, is it affecting them, um, in, in sort of their, um, [01:07:30] ability to run a successful industry? 

Eric Berley: [01:07:33] Yeah. Uh, the, the dairy farmers, um, it depends on who you're talking to because, uh, the farmers that are. Just selling, you know, milking 1600, hundred a head of cattle. Um, their, their business is like an automated, uh, computer module where the big, the big milk pickups, they're picking it up and it's all [01:08:00] regulated and it's all being pretty much sold.

You get to a place where you're so big that you bloat and you get out of the bit, those businesses like Dean foods, like literally gets so big. They get bought out or may, may go belly up a lot of dairy. There's a convention I've gone to it's Southeast, um, grass grazers association. So these are people that graze specifically they're dairy herds, and some have lost their.

Their [01:08:30] accounts, because for instance, I talked to one, uh, that got dropped by natural by nature because they added an oat milk line. So they were having trouble selling direct because they didn't have the processing equipment on farm. They were just, they just wanted to be dairy farmers and have someone pick up and for the milk.

So it's really about how they're, who, who they're selling to. And the Amish tend to have a very closed system of a community of known families of how many [01:09:00] mouths and they, that it's so tight that they know, um, that they, they will only bring in so many dairy, uh, cows to feed so many people. Um, so it's, it's more, it's very, uh, it's very secure.

It's, uh, it's a more secure, uh, approach, right. Rather than, and trying to like, get the big account on whole foods East coast or get the big account. Um, you're, you're not. They're not limited [01:09:30] by that kind of thing. We just happened to be at a nice benefit, right. Where the, sort of the extra cream on the, on the cake.

Eli Kulp: [01:09:38] There you go. That's cool. Um, you know, I think, you know, as, as your journey, you know, these are even though your 16, 17 year old 18 year old business, you're continuing to look at the future, right? Like you have to, um, look at that. And I think that's, you know, um, talking about that, you know, the way you're looking at it, I think [01:10:00] is brilliant and kudos to you guys for doing that.

And, you know, it's, it's, it's guys like you that are, um, they're going to keep. The artisan movement alive in food. So, um, we need people like you guys, and I appreciate you guys. Thank you so much, you know? Absolutely. Um, you know, I do want to touch before we go and kind of come up on a time, um, here, but you know, Shane's candy.

Let's talk about that for a minute. Uh, sort of the history [01:10:30] of it. What are Shane's confess your ISA candy chains. Confectionary is the proper name, the oldest candy shop in America. And we have it right here in Philadelphia, uh, on market street between front and Leticia street. Um, like I feel honored. I've told you before, like I said earlier, like just being able to just go out my front door and take a right and sort of run into you guys this little candy land of sorts.

I can, [01:11:00] I could not think of a better place to raise my kid. I know he'll have those memories forever. Um, But Shane confectionary, I mean, was the history of there. Talk about the history and, and kind of what really got you guys into that. And it was like, we need to have this in our, in our portfolio and we're going to jump in head first and, and, uh, you know, get this thing up and running again.

Ryan Berley: [01:11:24] Yeah. Yeah. So we've been a part of Shane's for 10, 11 years, I guess. [01:11:30] And it was very much part of the organic growth. Um, Eric really did all of the work engineering, the ice cream department, the at recipes, he was making ice cream in Northern liberties, above of, uh, a little diner in their commercial kitchen.

And that, that was getting more and more difficult as our volumes were growing. And we always knew we wanted to make ice cream on the block while we really never had the right space. And. [01:12:00] Shane's represented well and an incredible opportunity in that it was this gorgeous historic candy store, um, but also a tremendous amount of work and commitment.

So it took us a couple of years to get up the courage, to talk to Mr. Shane seriously about his future there and our interest in, uh, purchasing the building [01:12:30] and the, in the business. And it was really twofold. One was to move ice cream production onto the block, and that would be great. And the second thing was to create.

A seasonal line of chocolates that would help, um, level out some of the, the curve that the high screen businesses, you know, we were closing in the winter for the first couple of years because we needed a break. We didn't have managers at that [01:13:00] time. And, uh, it's hard to build a business when you have to lay everybody off and shut down for two months.

Restart. Yeah. Starting the engines up was like crazy challenging. So anyway, that's. Kind of what historically the candy business offered to a lot of soda fountain operators. In fact, they were all one. If you think back to the early 20th century soda fountain shops traditionally would have a fountain [01:13:30] counter on one side and the candy counter on the other side.

Oh. Uh, so if you didn't feel like an ice cream soda or it was Christmas time, you might be, then they're shopping for, um, you know, a box of chocolates. And so they really did always kind of go hand in hand and it was traditionally the same proprietors that actually made the chocolates in the old stores.

Um, now literally there were a lot of stores kind of like ours, maybe not on the same scale, but, [01:14:00] um, I think I 

Eli Kulp: [01:14:01] read in the Shane confectionary Wikipedia page that there was something like 1600. Confectionary shops in Philadelphia at one time. Is that the number of some has coming close to that? Yeah. I was like, Holy crap.

Now let's just, you know, Hershey's Mars, you know, everywhere and every store on every corner, but back then, there was no that, Nope. I mean, it was all [01:14:30] small opposites, individual confectionary, um, producers all over the different neighborhoods. Yeah. It was amazing to think. God, no, I wish I could go back there.

Right. This, this sample from one block to the next or one neighbor to the next and Italian or Irish or, you know, or, or Quaker or whatever, you know, the different cause they, you know, they're bringing that knowledge from where they came from exactly. Southern Italy versus Northern Italy. Right. Like, you know, where, where in Germany did they arrive [01:15:00] from?

You know, what was their, what was, what did they grew up on? Yeah. How do you wish you'd go back to just turn that clock? You know, one 

Eric Berley: [01:15:07] of the stores, um, we felt like were air air takers too, or was Young's, uh, candies on Girard Avenue. Um, is it 23rd, 23rd. And, um, that, that's where Ryan bought the clear toy, hard candy molds, the, uh, the German, um, [01:15:30] confection that was brought to, to Philadelphia.

And there were all those cultural stories through confectionary. I think what, you're, what you're saying. We, we kind of now live in like a, an Oreo cupcake world, um, that, um, so Shane's has been a bit of a catch-all of a lot of different cultural stories because you, whether it's the Irish, um, [01:16:00] influenced.

Potato like the Irish potato, the, uh, coconut, um, cinnamon rolled potato confection. Um, that was a Shane, you know, uh, Shane signature because the family's Irish and the clear toy have this German, um, you know, inspiration and, uh, background, um, some of the gingerbread molds and the cookie molds, historic cookie molds that we use that are made of [01:16:30] wood that we turn into silicone.

Those are made from immigrants, um, various places in, in mostly Europe, I would say, um, that adds these layers of, um, intrigue on Shane confectionary as a brand. Um, and it also, it also is fun for the staff to be able to share this one day and that another day. And. 

Eli Kulp: [01:16:58] That's true. I'm sure you [01:17:00] rotate the staff throughout the facility.

And I mean, yeah, you gain quite some experience of unique and different ways of looking at confectionary as an ice cream and sodas and all this stuff. I mean, 

Ryan Berley: [01:17:14] and you, you really recognize that the human once the human is multifaceted and can do so much more than work on a factory line. And we see it day in and day out with our mostly young staff, but they just want to [01:17:30] try this and try that and, you know, get some experience with their hands in a world where it's very difficult to find work that varied in an interesting and work that at the end of the day, you can see, and you can make somebody happy for you're going to, you're going to create a smile.

Um, I mean, 

Eli Kulp: [01:17:53] this, that whole block is just it's happy time, you know what I [01:18:00] mean? Like you got those three stores and you know, and don't sleep on Franklin bar either. I mean, what you guys are doing there. I mean, it's sort of the best kept secret for me because I can, you know, the lines a little bit shorter and it's blowing up now.

I know, I know it's out. I think it's out, man. I'm just like, 

Eric Berley: [01:18:18] right. That's where we dip the ice cream into our homemade chocolate bar 

Eli Kulp: [01:18:23] form, which are, I mean, then you got the custards there. It's just, [01:18:30] it's too much. You guys are too much sometimes for me, me and my waistline. But, uh, but no, I, like I said earlier, um, it's been so great getting to know you guys over the years.

Um, I know that. Yeah, there's more to your story. I know that you guys are going to continue to evolve. Um, you know, Eric, we've had some deep conversations over the years about, you know, the future of what is, what is ice cream and what's going on. I know Ryan, you had some great ideas up your sleeve [01:19:00] about, you know, using your antique background to showcase the history of, of, you know, uh, ice cream and sweets and everything.

So, um, you know, it's, it's, it's, it's a pretty awesome endeavor that you guys have met on. I'm sure it's been quite the ride ups downs, you know, left right. One day to the next, I mean, that's entrepreneurship at its best. And you know, I, I look forward to seeing you guys continue to evolve and, and, um, you know, continue to be, um, you know, a [01:19:30] place that it's, it's, it's a local local brand, but it's also nationally recognized people come here from all over the place to get your ice cream.

I mean, people are eating your ice cream. At what time do you open. 10:00 AM sometimes right on the weekends. There's 11:00 AM like there's families coming out and it's like, they just, they're just going to get it now because they don't want to like come back later and you know, they don't want to miss, you know, they have opportunity to get it.

So, uh, [01:20:00] tell like what time, what time do you close on weekends? 11, midnight, midnight on the weekends and on a nice warm day, a nice hot summer afternoon. It is, it is going until midnight. Well, you'll 

Ryan Berley: [01:20:11] be open 24 hours. You start to realize why the 24 hour diner became a thing. 

Eli Kulp: [01:20:17] Right. People want what they want when they want it.

You got it. Yeah. So, um, is there anything else that when I kind of cover that we didn't kind of get to, or do you feel pretty good about this. 

[01:20:30] Ryan Berley: [01:20:31] That's fantastic. We look forward to continue conversations and, and your, um, helpful listening ear and your, your words of wisdom over the years have been particularly inspiring and your own actions and, and your resilience is really something, um, to be mindful of day to day.

Eli Kulp: [01:20:55] Well, thanks, man. I appreciate 

Eric Berley: [01:20:56] that. You're incredible force Eli and don't stop. [01:21:00] Just don't stop, 

man. 

Eli Kulp: [01:21:02] Try not to keep it going. Just keep swimming forward. Right. We can do it's all we can. All right, listen guys, this has been awesome. I appreciate your time and your stories. I learned some stuff. I know the listeners will learn some things and, um, if they have, if you haven't been down there, I mean, if they listen to this and they don't seek you guys out, then whatever, forget them.

So just, uh, just come early and, uh, come off, come off. There you [01:21:30] go. All right guys. Have an awesome day. Um, And just keep doing it. Thank you. All right. 

Eric Berley: [01:21:36] Thanks.

Eli Kulp: [01:21:41] Thanks for listening to the chef radio podcast. If you'd like to support the show, please leave us a review. Wherever you listen to your podcast, it helps others find the show and allows us to continue to make great content. The chef radio podcast is produced by radio kismet post-production and sound designed by [01:22:00] studio D podcast production.

And I am your host, Eli Kulp.